Backup schemes
TI 2016 build 6027 on Win10 (although I have had similar problems with TI 2014)
Scenario:
I define a new backup job. With that job selected on the left-hand side, I select the Options button at the bottom. I then select the Backup Scheme tab to define a custom backup scheme by using the pull-down to select Custom Scheme, selecting the Backup Method options I want, clicking Save As and giving my new backup scheme a name. Call it A. Then clicking OK
So far so straightforward
I then define a second backup job and create a second backup scheme (as above). Call this scheme B.
If I select the first backup job again and inspect its Options, its Backup Scheme has changed to B. I change it back to A, click Save and click OK. But if I check its Options again, it is still B. Forrever B!
It appears always to select the scheme name which was the latest to be newly defined, and this is the one which appears immediately under the Custom Scheme entry in the pulldown list.
I am clearly doing something stupid. Any ideas?
[In passing, I assume that the Save / Save As / Delete apply setting the NAME of the custom scheme, and that the DETAILS in the Backup Methods below are only saved under that name when OK is clicked: the manual is vague about this]
Hello Steve
Thanks for your trials.
I wasn't having problems setting up the two backup jobs themselves: if I try to select an existing job (on the LH side) when half-way through defining a new one, TI warns that I will lose all the settings of the new one unless - as you say - you either initiate a backup or a schedule one 'Later'. Although quite why Acronis won't let you simply save a new job defintition is unclear.
My problem was that a backup job would not keep the Backup Scheme definition name I told it to use but selected another one.
Ok, sorry I missed the part about the custom schemes in my test and was able to recreate the same issue you have been seeing, but only when the two new backup schemes are identical, in which case my new scheme B (the first I created) is used by default by both new tasks (A & B).
If I change my new scheme A to do a differential type of backup instead of a full like scheme B, then Save scheme A, the setting to use scheme A in task A is kept.
As to the other point about selecting a different task when part-way through defining a new task, then you are correct and the warning from ATIH says clearly that it will discard the settings for the new task if you continue, which it does if you continue to open the other task. This is the way the application is designed and I suspect has been this way for more than just the 2016 version (though I haven't tested it on earlier versions).
Tnx again for your tests Steve; they made me wonder what would happen if:
a. I created a second backup job using a different backup type (incremental instead of full, for example), saved this custom Backup Scheme under a new name, and then edited the backup type to be the same as that used in the first backup job (e.g. amended it back to full)
or
b. I created a second backup job with the same backup type (both full, for example) but with (e.g.) different cleanup settings and saved this custom Backup Scheme under a new name.
It is, of course, quite legitimate to want two backup schemes of the same type (e.g. full) but with different cleanup settings. All my machines have two full backup jobs, and these jobs back up to external disks A or B alternately (after a backup, the disk concerned goes to a fireproof 'media chest' in a different building and the other disk is released from there to the PC area). If the backup disks were identical in size, then having identical backup schemes wouldn't matter, but they vary from 2TB to 4TB and cleanup settings for each are a bit different.
If the strange behaviour of TI is by design, it is a nasty hidden side-effect and I cannot see the point. There is a good reason to want two identical backup schemes with different names: if I amend such a scheme for one backup job, I don't necessarily want the amended version to be used automatically by other backup jobs.
Max
Max, I can understand your concerns and the reasons for what you are wanting the application to do.
Issues with regard to the design of the application are beyond the scope of what I or the other user volunteers in the forum can address - I can only recommend that you use the Feedback tool (in Help) to pass on your concerns to the Acronis developers.
My comment about the design was purely in the context of the behaviour of ATIH if you decide to switch from the new task your are configuring before completing that new configuration, to an existing task, not the behaviour with the backup schemes.
If you create two new backup schemes with different names but these are identical in actions, then under normal circumstances they are interchangeable and I presume that is why the application just defaults to the first such scheme.
If you include even a slight / minor difference in the backup scheme actions, i.e. in the cleanup actions / days held etc, then I would, like yourself, expect that scheme to be preserved and used where I specify.
I guess that we are getting to a point where we can't really take this conversation a lot further - the only recommendation I can offer is to create any new schemes with obvious names that show the key differences between them, i.e. Incr 3 versions or Diff 2 versions etc.
Regards, Steve
Hello Steve
Firstly many thanks for your tests and explanation - much appreciated. I will summarise things in a Feedback to Acronis and probably cross-reference these posts.
And I will do some trials myself when I get back to the office (I am currently travelling).
I guess what seems counter-intuitive is that it isn't working in the way one would expect. I will try to find what makes one Backup Scheme different from another such that they can be named diffferently: full to incremental is an obvious major difference but whether miinor changes to cleanup settings are also sufficient I don't know. My concern - as I have already mentioned - is that if I have two backup jobs which initially have an identical Backup Scheme (not just backup type such as full but also identical cleanup settings) and are thus forced by TI to use the same Scheme name, and then I amend the scheme for say the first job, the amendment will apply to the second job also!
Best wishes
Max
I have now done some experiments, and the way custom Backup Scheme naming and scheme definitions IS counterintuitive...
When I select a backup job and click Options and then the Backup Scheme tab, TI appears to work as follows:
- ignore whatever Backup Scheme name was saved when the backup definition was last edited
- retrieve the detailed settings (backup type e.g. full, and cleanup options that were saved when that backup definition was last edited
- check in the list of saved backup schemes to find the first which has a defintion which matches the detaield settings
- display its name in the Backup Scheme name box
Further, if I change any detail of the backup scheme (e.g. any of the cleanup settings) but don't Save the scheme, a new BLANK scheme is created with the amended definitions...
decomplexity,
I'd say the behavior is not normal as changes should be saved in the same task they are being edited in. Not sure if this was an upgrade from another previous version of ATIH ,or if the OS was upgraded while ATIH was already installed, but I suspect a full cleanup and reinstall would resolve most of these issues. Please see the cleanup tool in my signature and follow the instructions in the article. Also, be sure to run the cleanup tool and the ATIH installer again using the right click and "run as administrator" option in Windows (even if logged in as admin already) to ensure the highest privileges possible when installing.
Also, it is not recommended to modify backup tasks once they have already started. Acronis allows this, but I almost wish they didn't because it usually corrupts the backup database somewhere down the line. You will save time and trouble in the long run by creating new backup tasks anytime you want to make modifications. Not ideal in some situations, but if you want good backups with the Windows version of ATIH, this is what most of us in the MVP program will recommend. Alternatively, consider taking an offline backup wiht the bootable recovery media from time to time as a backup, backup plan. Those are completely outside of Windows and less likely to be impacted by other things in the OS (Windows updates, malwarey, antivirus programs, user configurations, third party applicaitons, OS corruption/problems, etc).