ATI2012 Date Variable in Filename Issue
Yesterday I upgraded to build 6131 from 5455. (I used the clean-up tool, did a fresh install and then imported my backup jobs.)
Although I was able to make a disk image just fine, this morning my daily differential file backup failed. For various reasons I decided to create a new backup job which seems to be working fine, except I can't make variables work in the resulting archive names.
I've read the manual and knowledge base articles where I'm told to select "browse" in the location area, enter the name and then "add" variables from the drop-down box (or manually type them). Unlike with ATI (a few versions ago), it seems the backup job and archive names are somehow linked. That is, my archive and job names end up being the same, and the @date@ variable is not recognized as anything other than text.
I would like a backup name and resulting archive as follows:
Job Name = All Data to E Backup
Archive Name = myusername_data_@date@
Example resulting filename = myusername_data_20111210.tib
But I cannot make this happen. No matter whether I enter the archive location or backup job name first, the backup job name takes precedence and overwrites the archive location name. If I copy the archive name to the backup job name, I end up with an archive named:
myusername_data_@date@1.tib
If I type my desired archive name in the job config after specifying the archive location with variables, I end up with an archive named:
All_Data_to_E_Backup1.tib
In older versions of ATI (can't remember how long ago), there were two fields where I could simply manually type both backup job name and archive location name (with variables) separately, and I ended up with a properly named job and archive that recognized the variables!
Can someone please advise me on how to get this working properly?
If I have to have a job named the same as my archive, fine. I just want the variables to work as variables and not as text strings!
TIA for your expert assistance! :-)
TrueImage will use parenthesis as part of its own naming convention. The user should avoid placing parenthesis. It is also suggested that the place some type of character such as an underscore or dash as the last character of the file name. The program may add numbers of numbers within parenthesis so the user must be aware that the names ending characters may well be altered.
As you have found out, the one and only place you can assign a name to the backup file is from within the intended storage folder as per the picture below.
Have you considered using
@user@_data_@date@__
which will produce
username_data_12-10-2011__.tib
you wanted the below.
myusername_data_(2011-12-10).tib
In the English version, I believe you will get month-day-year without any choices. Not sure about other versions.
Here are some examples of backup file names created via TI.
http://forum.acronis.com/forum/25851#comment-80487
Assigning file name to backup below
GroverH, thanks for your detailed reply. After I posted yesterday, I continued testing. I learned the reason the date variable wasn't recognized as a variable is that I had inadvertently entered the file extension .tib to the archive name after the variable. I would normally not use parentheses in any filename, but adding them seemed to make the variable work. What I soon discovered, however, is that simply *not* adding the file extension worked too.
I should have been more clear in my posts, as I do understand how variables and archive naming works in principle. My complaint is actually from a usability standpoint. IMNSHO, designing a GUI so it appears the user can enter a job name different from the archive name and then allowing the user to manually add a file extension that breaks the (archive name) variables is b-a-d. And I say that after having designed user interfaces for many years. The earlier interface was clearer, and it had the added benefit of allowing users to have a job name different from the archive name. I don't have a problem with Acronis removing that capability. I *do* have a problem with Acronis "dumbing down" the interface and ultimately making the otherwise simple process of adding variables more difficult. I'd prefer Acronis improve the GUI in this area, but they should at least *document* this weirdness!
Anyway, I do thank you for taking the time to provide some much-needed information. As I've been exporting & importing my backup jobs for the last several ATIH versions, I hadn't had to create a new job in quite some time.
As I said previously, I can live with having my job and archive names the same, and I now have a job (and archive name) minus the unwanted parentheses. :-)
Thanks so much for your response!
If I am understanding your correctly, it is possible to have a task name to be different than the backup file name. The first step is to create the backup file name when inside the storage folder and then return to the main page. Then, before saving the task, change the task name from the backup file name to the new task name. The backup file remains unchanged.
Your right about the tib extension. If the user types in the file extension, the program will also add another file extension. The user should only create the backup file name without any file extension and let the program add the extension. The program should be modified to strip out the extra extensions.
As you indicate your are using old cloned tasks, you should probably review the task option settings as the new 2012 has different default setting on several items--especially on the validation settings.
Also, thanks to your posting, I used the @date@ option and now see that the program has finally been modified to provide a year, month, day sequence.
I believe I tried that, and the archive file took on the name of the task....
Your right about the tib extension. If the user types in the file extension, the program will also add another file extension. The user should only create the backup file name without any file extension and let the program add the extension. The program should be modified to strip out the extra extensions.
Yes, I realize that. It was a mistake on my part, as I was working too quickly and not concentrating well enough. :-) ATI did not, however, add a second extension. It simply failed to recognize the variable as a variable and entered it as text. (And I do have Win7 set to *not* hide extensions.) My point is that the programmers *should* add some checks to protect users from themselves ... especially considering they're now marketing their application to general users. I've got 30 years experience in computer networking, security, etc., and because of some sloppy programming, poor documentation and inattention on my part, got me. How are general users supposed to deal with these weirdnesses? Don't get me wrong, I think ATI is a simply fantastic tool, and I upgrade every year, as I've been for many years now. I just have a complaint about the user interface in this area. I'm sure if I were using ATI in this manner everyday, I'd find it just fine. It remains, IMNSHO, a poor GUI in this respect.
As you indicate your are using old cloned tasks, you should probably review the task option settings as the new 2012 has different default setting on several items--especially on the validation settings.
Already done a while back. I'm beginning to think, however, that I should probably recreate all my tasks using the latest version.
Also, thanks to your posting, I used the @date@ option and now see that the program has finally been modified to provide a year, month, day sequence.
Yes, the @date@ variable now provides the proper (IMO) year, month, day date sequence. :-)
Thanks for your help, GroverH! :-)
I found it troublesome to use these variables in filenames -- enough so that I quit using them altogether -- ati tends to start adding numbers to filenames and seemed to me to have a harder time keeping track of which backups belonged together in which tasks.
If you have successes in thier use, please report back so that others can know what works and what doesn't.
I've been using @date@ for years without issue. But then I don't usually run each backup more than once a day. On the rare occasion I do, ATI does indeed append a numeral to the archive name. In the past when I did run certain backups more than once a day, I simply used @date@ and @time@. ATI only appends numerals to differentiate backups that would otherwise use the same name. So by using the @time@ variable, it's practically impossible for ATI to find the need to append the resulting archive names with the number of the backup.
I use an underscore to separate parts of the archive name, so resulting archive names look like this:
descriptivebackupname_@date@_@time@
As it's been a long time since I've used the @time@ variable, I can't tell you how ATI currently formats the time. I do recall that ATI used hours, minutes and seconds. So assuming it still does, I can't imagine you'd end up with ATI appending numerals.
One question that's come up now that I use a differential (with cleanup) scheme in my data backup job is how ATI can manage the job database if I should revert to an earlier image of my system drive. I intended to write another post asking that question, so I mention it here only because your post brought the subject to mind. :-)
HTH :-)
Edit: I just ran a test job using @date@_@time@ and see that ATI only uses the hours and minutes. I hope it at least uses military time, because there's no AM/PM indicator. My test job came out like this:
archive name = calibre_lib_@date@_@time@
file name = calibre_lib_2011-12-12_1041
next file name = calibre_lib_2011-12-12_1045
But I guess seconds are not *really* necessary. ;-)
I believe I tried that, and the archive file took on the name of the task....
GroverH, I did some more testing and find that indeed it *is* possible for task and archive names to be different, but the secret is to first name the archive, *save* the job, then edit, rename and save the job again. It appears the archive name can't be changed once the job is saved, which seems to be why this process works. I thought it might be necessary to actually run the job one time prior to renaming it, but no, it's only necessary to save, rename and save the job a second time.
It seems there's a bit of a discrepancy as to how this procedure works on my desktop as opposed to my laptop. Both run Win7SP1 x64 and are configured similarly. But my desktop has the ATI Plus Pack installed, and the laptop only has vanilla ATI. (Both run 6131.) On my desktop, after I "browse for destination," enter my archive name and click OK, the Backup Name is blank, so I had to copy/paste from the archive name field to the backup name field.
On my laptop, however, when I enter the archive name and click OK, the backup name is filled in with the archive name (without displaying the variable names). As I have no more installations with which to test, I don't know if this is an anomaly or a bug introduced by installing the plus pack. Also, I've done my testing on file backups only, not disk images.
I usually beta test when the opportunity arises, but this time I had my beta-test plate full, so I passed. This was an area where I'd like to have commented on certain issues, so I'll be sure to beta test next time the opportunity presents itself. :-)
In some respects, our discussion comes down to how we have become accustomed to using the program.
Because of how the task is already structured, my
Step 1: Select disks/partitions/data to be included in the backup.
Step 2: Select my own storage folder/disk. The program/default is never the folder or drive I wish to use so default there is always changed. See note-1.
Step 2a: Browse to the target storage folder and assign the backup name. Click OK to temporarily preserve the changed backup file name assignment.
Step 3: Assign all the options relating to type of backup, (full, diff,inc) and all the other miscellaneous options.
Step 4: If scheduling, assign schedule.
Sept 5: Assign task name which means highlighting and deleting the existing temporary program determined task name and assign a task name of my own choosing.
Step 6: Save the task by clicking backup now or later.
To fulfill my preferences, I do not care what default name is assigned to the backup file or the task name as both are going to be changed to my own choosing.
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Note-1: Some user have asked for the ability of select their own default storage folder rather than the program creating "My Backups" on every partition(which is bad programming).. This change would be ok but I probably would not use it as I use too many different folders to have a single default storage folder. I practice using a different folder or sub-foder for each task so to keep my backup chains confined to their own folders without mixing. Acronis says ok to the mixing but I have found mixing is a door to corrupt chains so I practice a no mixing rule--A different storage folder per task.
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Note-2: I believe more and more people are understanding the need for backups but need much more guidance on what this entails. This is an area that I have tried to convince Acronis of a greater need for more documentation/visuals/movies, etc. To me, this is a major weakness on the program. There has been considerable improvement in the documentation area but the user new to the product needs much more and hiding many of the options makes it more difficult. Using backup software does require a learning curve and good documentation and illustration can help. A picture is worth a 1000 words seems to true so I try to use a screen capture as much as possible in my postings and I wish they would use more visuals.
I've had a slightly different issue w/ ATIH 2012. For a long time I've named my backup datasets in the form name_@date@_@time@. All my backups are full, stand-alone items. With ATIH 2011 I would simply clone the settings of the previous backup job and start it. Lately, with ATIH 2012, this procedure sometimes results in a backup with a default "My_backup" name and sometimes with the characters "(1)" appended to the front or the back of the file name. On one of the three machines I use the unexpected "(1)" characters show up even if I describe the backup job from scratch. I can't find any reference in the documentation to this special appendage - neither what it signifies nor how to rid myself of it.
James,
What you see is ATI reverting to the default naming scheme (where a number between parenthesis indicates a full backup and a number along indicates a partial backup).
You have to click on the destination, scroll down to browse. Then, in the dialog window that pops up, double click your way until you have opened the folder you need. This will allow you to set the name you want.
Pat,
Thanks for the timely response.
I believe that I already did what you prescribe. Attached are screenshots of the completion of the name selection dialog, the summary before execution, and the job in progress. Note the "(1)" appended to the end of the filename in the execution shot. Prior to the 2012 version of ATIH and as recently as Jan 11, 2012 (with ATIH 2012) the parenthetical appendage was not inserted.
I've tried both configuring the backup job from scratch and cloning a previous job (ATIH 2012) which had not produced the appendage, but to no avail.
I cannot find any reference in the ATIH documentation to this parenthetical technique. I've saved and examined the log files generated by the job but the syntax is far to obtuse to be of use to me.
James,
I do suggest that you start a new task pointing to a new storage folder. This can be a sub-folder under your normal backup folder. As part of the new name assigned to the backup file, use a dash (-) or underscrore (_) as the last character in your file name. This will make identification a little easier.
Note post #2 above, this illustrates where you must go (inside the new storage folder) to assign the name you want to use. The name assigned to the task mayl differ from the name assigned to the backup file. The date or time variable being used in the backup file name will not show as part of the task name.
I do not see anything wrong with your tasks or naming convention. TI just appears to be become confused or corrupted which is I suggest new tasks pointing to new storage folders or sub-folders.
If ATI's backup list shows several tasks with the same name to the same folder, there is indeed a high chance that the database is messed up.
To clean up the backup list, move the TIB files you want to keep to another directory on the same disk (to avoid a long copy time), then, in ATI, delete the backup tasks. ATI will complain it cannot delete all files. Insist. Then create a new task.
Pat,
Thanks for your clarification. You were spot on regarding ". . . several tasks with the same name to the same folder . . .". I never could figure out why ATI had segregated the dozen or so full backups I had into three or four groups. Your purging procedure worked like a charm. Now, if I can only figure out what got me into this situation in the first place . . . .
In the English version, I believe you will get month-day-year without any choices. Not sure about other versions.
Thankfully, on my system ATI names with the more logical and internationally-accepted date format of year-month-day (at least, when running backup from ATI 2012 Recovery media). e.g. today would be 2012-01-16. Perhaps ATI bases the date format on the choices made in Windows Region and Language settings.
Hi Tuttle,
The more recent updates seem to have the "2012-01-16" as the date format."
Good stuff.
Here in Canada we're comfortable seeing both the U.S. formats and the more logical international formats, as well as both imperial and metric measures, since we deal both with the U.S. and the international community. But, the international date format is sure easier when you're trying to figure out if something labelled 2011-05-09 was May 9 or Sept. 5. Plus, when filenames containing datestamps, such as the ATI images, are sorted in something like Windows Explorer, the international format creates a more logical sequence.
Yes, there is a continuing problem in ati since Acronis 1st changed to using an internal database to track backup task settings and backup files. It is difficlult to handle all of the ways that things can go "wrong"; the error-handling is very complex and not yet perfected.
When you make a task, don't muss with ti afterwards. If a tasks seems to go wonky, exit and reload ati and see if it straightenes out, if not, delete your tasks and start over or live with the wonks.
Or use the batch file system to manage your backups -- jsut search on the forum for chain2gen; it's a bit of a pita to set up but much more reliable than the ati database.
I've had a slightly different issue w/ ATIH 2012. For a long time I've named my backup datasets in the form name_@date@_@time@. All my backups are full, stand-alone items. With ATIH 2011 I would simply clone the settings of the previous backup job and start it. Lately, with ATIH 2012, this procedure sometimes results in a backup with a default "My_backup" name and sometimes with the characters "(1)" appended to the front or the back of the file name. On one of the three machines I use the unexpected "(1)" characters show up even if I describe the backup job from scratch. I can't find any reference in the documentation to this special appendage - neither what it signifies nor how to rid myself of it.