Differential Backup not working
I've got Acronis True Image Home 2009. Just installed on a new Win7/64-bit OS Laptop, and created a new backup routine. I told it I wanted differential, but when I check out my backup files something seems wrong. I have 3 backups so far. The first was about 53GB, the second about 54GB, and the last is about 55GB. Now, something doesn't seem right here. A differential backup should only contain the changed files in subsequent backups, right? Not the entire thing. Unless every file in my system changed (not likely), these backups seem wrong.
Any ideas? Or am I mis-understanding this?
Jesse
and yes,
a differential backup records what has changed since the base full backup.
a incremental backup records whatever has changed since the last incremental.
Are you executing these backup
a. based on a task schedule
b. or are you right clicking the task and choosing start;
c. or are you using a desktop shortcut to start the backup?
If executing from a desktop shortcut, your first full backup must be executed via either step a or b.
It's a laptop for both personal and business use. I'm pretty much the "IT Guy" in my company. I wouldn't think that de-fraging would change a file's date/time, so I don't think that's the issue. Besides, I haven't rebooted the thing for 3 days anyway, and the problem still exists.
a. I am backing up based a task schedule.
b. I have tried that as well. In fact, I just changed it from differential to incremental and right-clicked and did a start, and now I have a second file that has a size if 81GB. I did add a LOT of music files to my hard drive this morning, though, but still, I wouldn't think that the file should be more than about 30GB.
c. I am not using a desktop shortcut to start the backup.
I use the drive for secondary backups (alternate backup methods too), and I can't even fit those on there because Acronis is hogging all the space by not creating the backups correctly.
Jesse
If TrueImage suspects something wrong with the drive (bad sectors or file errors,etc), it will switch from backing up only the used sectors to a sector by sector backup. This may be something you want to check by running chkdsk c: /R from the command prompt--would be one method.
I've just learned that 2009 was not compatible with W7 anyway. I've just upgraded to TI2010, and am making my first backup now. We'll see how the differential goes tonight. Hopefully that will solve it. If not, I'll be back.
Jesse
I have the same problem with TI2010. I'm running XP Pro SP3.
I have three backups for four drives (two drives on one backup, the others are one drive per backup).
I launched the original backups manually, and then scheduled them to run as incremental backups.
Volume in drive Z is Backups
Volume Serial Number is 2466-601E
Directory of Z:\
03/24/2010 11:16 AM 0 dir.txt
03/20/2010 03:13 PM My Backups
03/20/2010 08:08 PM 280,302,645,248 System_C_F_3_20_2010.tib
03/23/2010 12:28 AM 140,128,792,064 System_C_F_3_22_2010.tib
03/21/2010 01:03 AM 274,175,725,056 System_D_3_20_2010.tib
03/22/2010 03:29 PM 693,225,984 System_D_3_22_2010.tib
03/23/2010 08:17 AM 341,967,325,696 System_D_3_23_2010.tib
03/24/2010 09:12 AM 0 System_D_3_24_2010.tib
03/21/2010 09:11 AM 441,912,734,720 System_E_3_21_2010.tib
03/23/2010 07:40 PM 383,396,143,616 System_E_3_23_2010.tib
9 File(s) 1,862,576,592,384 bytes
1 Dir(s) 18,691,018,752 bytes free
In each case, I've only made very minor changes (if any) between backups, certainly not 140-383GB worth of changes, but I'm still getting these huge "incremental" backups.
Between the 3/22 System_D backup and the 3/23 backup I reformatted that drive to expand the partition and then restored from the Acronis backup. That part worked fine, but when I ran the next backup on 3/23 it looks like it backed up the entire drive even though I had changed virtually nothing since the restore (the 3/24 back up is still running, going on two hours now, thus the 0byte file... I haven't made any significant changes since yesterday).
I guess I'll try chkdsk once this finishes but these are all relatively new drives and it would be odd if all three of them were failing at once.
Between the 3/22 System_D backup and the 3/23 backup I reformatted that drive to expand the partition and then restored from the Acronis backup. That part worked fine, but when I ran the next backup on 3/23 it looks like it backed up the entire drive even though I had changed virtually nothing since the restore (the 3/24 back up is still running, going on two hours now, thus the 0byte file... I haven't made any significant changes since yesterday).
Perhaps I am misunderstanding but I would expect any backup which followed the format and restore would rightfully be a full size backup since all the data changed position on the disk as the result of the restore.
I launched the original backups manually, and then scheduled them to run as incremental backups.
If I am understanding that you edited the task following the first original full backup, the edit might explain your problem as the tasks do not accept the edits accurately. If edited, I would suggest that you create new tasks with all the correct settings and see if continue to have the same problem. Creating a new task solves many problems.
If a files position on the hard drive is what determines if TI backs the file up instead of it's date/time stamp, and if Windows 7 defrags the hard drive frequently (without even asking), then Incremental/differential backups are pretty much useless, aren't they?
Jesse
Between the 3/22 System_D backup and the 3/23 backup I reformatted that drive to expand the partition and then restored from the Acronis backup. That part worked fine, but when I ran the next backup on 3/23 it looks like it backed up the entire drive even though I had changed virtually nothing since the restore (the 3/24 back up is still running, going on two hours now, thus the 0byte file... I haven't made any significant changes since yesterday).Perhaps I am misunderstanding but I would expect any backup which followed the format and restore would rightfully be a full size backup since all the data changed position on the disk as the result of the restore.
Well, yes and no, I guess. I get that the disk is different now, but it would be nice if Acronis were smart enough to recognize that the data came from a backup. I was disappointed but not surprised that Acronis effectively made a new full backup after the restoration, but that doesn't explain why the two other disks got huge incremental backups as well.
I launched the original backups manually, and then scheduled them to run as incremental backups.If I am understanding that you edited the task following the first original full backup, the edit might explain your problem as the tasks do not accept the edits accurately. If edited, I would suggest that you create new tasks with all the correct settings and see if continue to have the same problem. Creating a new task solves many problems.
So is it your understanding that if I do a manual full backup and then create a new, scheduled, incremental backup job, that will work better than modifying the original backup job? Seems counter-intuitive but I'll give it a shot.
So is it your understanding that if I do a manual full backup and then create a new, scheduled, incremental backup job, that will work better than modifying the original backup job? Seems counter-intuitive but I'll give it a shot.
1. Editing a taskis iffy at best. It can be done but only if you take special precautions to set the edited task up correctly I do not recommend editing a task because TrueImage changes the options and sometimes the user is not aware of the changes made.
2. What I am saying is to create one new original task which will first create a full backup and then the next time the scheduled task is run, the same task will create an incremental or differential based on your choice of options made in the creation of the task.
I would also suggest that you consider the Chain2Gen option listed inside my signature below. Its use will help you manage your backup retention.
2. What I am saying is to create one new original task which will first create a full backup and then the next time the scheduled task is run, the same task will create an incremental or differential based on your choice of options made in the creation of the task.
Thanks for your help, and apologies for being slow on the uptake, but the way I would do this would be to create a new incremental/differential task, and then use only that task? The first time it runs, it will create a full backup? I just want to make sure I understand what you're saying. My previous experience has been with Windows Backup where I just created a full backup manually and then scheduled an incremental backup and everything was ducky.
I would also suggest that you consider the Chain2Gen option listed inside my signature below. Its use will help you manage your backup retention.
I'm not going to have enough space on my backup drive to do generational backups but thanks for the recommendation. I'll be happy if I can just get simple incremental backups working for each of my drives. If I get to that point, I'll think about buying another external drive and getting a little more fancy.
Jesse,
I'm a little confused about your reply in post 3.
I wouldn't think that de-fraging would change a file's date/time
You didn't mention anything about a problem with a files date/time in your original post.
Have you tried deleting the tasks and remaking them?
Arthur,
IMHO, one of the reasons you are getting full size backups is your non-use of a single backup name. In order for either an incremental or a differential supplemental backup, the program must recognize the prior backup and then append a sequential number to the backup.
If your base backup named "MyBackup-" , the program internally considers this backup to be named "MyBackup-1 and will name the next backup (either incremental or differential) to be "MyBackup-2.
So after your backup task runs 3 times, your backup folder will contain three files which reads
MyBackup-.tib (first full base backup)
MyBackup-2.tib (2nd backup but first incremental or differential--whichever type was optioned in the task)
MyBackup-3.tib (3rd backup but 2nd differential or incremental--whichever type was optioned in the task)
I will create a sample task attachment picture for you to see as to how to create the task. I'll try to post this either tonight or tomorrow.
Is it your plans for TrueImage to overwrite the originals or do plan to retain a few copies?
Reconsider the use of Chain2Gen. It is excellent in helping you to maintain your retention--even when space is limited and when you only want to retain a few number.
IMHO, one of the reasons you are getting full size backups is your non-use of a single backup name. In order for either an incremental or a differential supplemental backup, the program must recognize the prior backup and then append a sequential number to the backup.
OK, but I'm using the default name that Acronis supplied/suggested when I created the task. In fact, pretty much everything I'm doing is based on the default settings, with the exception of using "Normal" priority instead of "Low" priority for the backup tasks.
And if Acronis uses the file names to determine which previous backup goes with the current task, why would it matter if I edit the task (as long as I don't change the name)?
Is it your plans for TrueImage to overwrite the originals or do plan to retain a few copies?
My plan is to do a master backup and then incremental backups after that. In theory, this should give me access to prior versions of changed files; I don't know if Acronis actually supports this or not; it's not really a show-stopper for me in any case. My main priority is to have one reliable backup of my data. If and when I ever get this stuff working, I may try saving generations of my system disk backup, but a lot of my other data (e.g. my Itunes folder) is (a) very large, so I don't want to triple the amount of storage space I devote to backing it up and (b) not really important enough to warrant that approach, IMO.
My original post wasn't really about dates. My assumption (maybe incorrectly?) is that a differential is determined by date/time changes. In other words, if I do a full backup and tell it that I want to do differential backups from this point forward, that it will use the date/time stamp on a file to determine if it should include it in the subsequent backups. That's the only reason that I mentioned the date/time stamp. As was stated in my post, I wouldn't think that defragging would change the date/time file, therefore, I wouldn't think that it would cause it to backup my entire hard drive during what should be a differential backup if it defragged. The reason for this was that someone mentioned that Windows 7 defrags your hard drive every time it boots. But, I don't think that is the problem either because I hadn't even booted my laptop for 3 days after getting it, and I still had that problem.
Anyway... Someone mentioned another thing that I'm wondering about. That TI will have to recognize the file name in order to create a differential or incremental backup. This being the case, the file name must be the same. TI2010 appears to have a nifty feature that allows you to make the date part of the file name by using the text "@date" as part of the file name. I like that, so when I re-created my backup, I left that there. Will this cause it to not recognize my original backup and create another full backup again when it should only create a smaller differential backup?
Jesse
My original post wasn't really about dates. My assumption (maybe incorrectly?) is that a differential is determined by date/time changes. In other words, if I do a full backup and tell it that I want to do differential backups from this point forward, that it will use the date/time stamp on a file to determine if it should include it in the subsequent backups. That's the only reason that I mentioned the date/time stamp. As was stated in my post, I wouldn't think that defragging would change the date/time file, therefore, I wouldn't think that it would cause it to backup my entire hard drive during what should be a differential backup if it defragged.
As someone else pointed out earlier in this thread, apparently Acronis uses the state of your disk's sectors to determine what needs to be backed up rather than the date & timestamp. I'm not sure what I think of that but I'm willing to give it a go (I don't have Win7 so I don't have to worry about unintended defragging).
Anyway... Someone mentioned another thing that I'm wondering about. That TI will have to recognize the file name in order to create a differential or incremental backup. This being the case, the file name must be the same. TI2010 appears to have a nifty feature that allows you to make the date part of the file name by using the text "@date" as part of the file name. I like that, so when I re-created my backup, I left that there. Will this cause it to not recognize my original backup and create another full backup again when it should only create a smaller differential backup?
I certainly hope that Acronis isn't so brain-damaged that it can't recognize the file name that it suggests as the default.
That said, I noticed that my new backup -- started as an Incremental, not a full -- includes an extra "1" at the end, i.e. System_C_F_3_24_20101.tib, instead of System_C_F_3_20_2010.tib (which was my older backup). So that may have been related to the problem I was having before... we'll see what happens when it comes time to do my next backup, but I would have to think that it will be smart enough to recognize the date token for what it is.
I am not an authority on the use of dates within a backup name. My prior comments are as I understand them but I could be mistaken about the use of dates when creating either incremental type or differential type backups. Hopefully, someone from Acronis will join the discussion.
As to whether a file has changed, Acronis uses it placement on the disk as its guide. If its location (sector number) on the disk changes, the file is included in the next supplemental backup. Some users have 3rd party defrags or Win7 auto defrags when will defrag automatically. The next backup following a defrag will cause files which have been relocated (moved to a different sector but file path and size remain the same) to be included in the next incremental type or differential type backup.
You are putting your recovery possibilities at risk if create too many incremental type backups. Check item 7-H inside my signature index for a more detailed explanation.
When attempting a task edit, the first thing that happens is that TrueImage pops an alert windows about a possible change of backup name or number. Most often, this window is a change and it may not be the change you want or expect. The user must know what is correct and change anything that Acronis has modified. This is not so much an issue of what the user chances but what TrueImage changes--based on what has occurrred. If I get a chance, sometimes over the next day or so, I will try to post some examples--if time permits. If you right click on a task, you will see a rename option and a change schedule option, etc. The changes via this right click menu have not effect on backup name or numbers. It is the use of the edit option which may cause unexpected changes.
Generally speaking, it is a waste of backup space to include audio or video files in the same repeating backups. Many users will copy or move them to a alternate media (another drive or dvd or online backups, etc). This helps to keep the backups small. Or, if you have alternate copies of those type files, you can invoke the exclude option and exclude them from your backups.
Just FYI, I'm good now. I guess it must have been an issue with TI2009. I upgraded to TI2010, and this morning, I've got the original backup, which is about 80GB, and I've got a differential which is about 1.8GB. Much more what I would expect. The base name is the same (7of9_C_3_24_2010.tib), though. We'll see what happens tonight when it backs up for 3/25. If it doesn't recognize the base name because it is 7of9_C_3_24_2010, then I guess I'll have to eliminate the date part of it.
Jesse