Acronis 2013 has Crashed my system and I can't recover it.
Please can anybody help me.
I ma currently sat here with a live chat window open. It says please hold while we connect you etc...
I've been sat here about half an hour or so waiting.
I've just bought 2013 this evening, but I have been using 2011 for a couple of years.
I installed it OK and created a new safe Zone OK. Then I wrote a new recovery boot disc OK.
I then decided to make sure the disc was working and seeing my drives and back ups.
That seemed OK as well but when I closed the disc it shut down and rebooted (The PC is an Assus CM6650) but now the PC sticks in the Assus pre boot screen and doesn't respond to anything. I had to hold the on/off button to shut it down. I treied the newly written Acronis boot disc but it still doesn't get passed the Assus start up screen and boot, I tried the Windows rescue disc and that is thye same.
After about 15 or 20 minutes of showing the Assus start up screen the screen goes black with just a DOS type curser flashing top left.
Please can anybody help I need to get into this machine, it is only a few months old and was working fine until I installed 2013.
Thanks James for that.
Sorry I didn't reply last night but shortly after I posted on the forum the chat window opened. Then afterwards the Forum link would not connect for some reason although I could get on the site and log on.
Anyway the advisor said more or less the same as you re. the BIOS order but seemed reluctant to accept what else I was telling him. I know they must be busy and he had spent quite a some time with me which I am grateful for. ( I'm not the fastest with a key board)
I do understand about boot order but that had not occurred to me as a possibility as just the day prior to this happening I had actually checked the BIOS to see if it was set to CD boot as I wanted to try one last time to see if the new TI 11 boot disc image I downloaded from the support site could see the SATA Drives before buying 2013, I booted successfully with the TI 11 disc but it still couldn't see the drives, I also booted successfully with the windows Rescue CD which I tried just to see if it could see the W7 image I also have. Then I tried a Linux Mint CD to see if that could see my SATA internal and external drives which it could, and all 3 booted OK and I was able to return to normal boot afterwards.
Then last night, on the chat adviser's instructions, I disconnected all the USB stuff, and immediately I disconnected one of my two ext drives (which is a WD 1Tb with auto-sleep) the Assus went into boot. So something on the WD ext Drive was stopping it and boot order must be USB first, but up to using the new Acronis Boot Disc hang at boot had not happened before. I am now faced with the task of trawling the WD ext. Drive trying to find what is causing boot to hold up but as there is nothing that I can think of that is remotely bootable on that disc I am not sure where to start.
At the moment I haven't got time for that or even to go into the BIOS and also check what might be going on there, I'll probably get around to it later today.
But I was wondering if anybody else has experienced this sort of issue.
Hello Everyone,
Thank you for your comments and your help James F.
James S, in addition to James' valuable suggestions, could you please let us know if you created an Acronis Secure Zone on an external hard drive? In addition, could you attach the following report called Acronis report 51?
Please let me know if you have additional questions.
Thank you.
I disconnected all the USB stuff, and immediately I disconnected one of my two ext drives (which is a WD 1Tb with auto-sleep) the Assus went into boot. So something on the WD ext Drive was stopping it and boot order must be USB first, but up to using the new Acronis Boot Disc hang at boot had not happened before. I am now faced with the task of trawling the WD ext. Drive trying to find what is causing boot to hold up but as there is nothing that I can think of that is remotely bootable on that disc I am not sure where to start.
Unless I'm missing something, this seems no great mystery. Your system wouldn't boot with the WD drive attached because:
- Your BIOS has USB boot as higher priority, yet there is no bootable system on the WD drive so the boot cannot proceed.
OR
- The WD drive is one that includes optional security/encryption. Such drives have a VCD (Virtual CD) partition, which your system recognizes as a CD drive. Boot is encountering that VCD first, but it is not bootable so the boot cannot proceed.
Hi Anton thanks for your help with this,
Just came home for a spot of lunch and checked the forum,
Decided I had time to run the report, from the 2013 installation as I allowed the report facility to install.
But something strange has happened, last night when the system rebooted Windows launched into the start up repair screen and I let it do its thing.
It was then late and spent some time trying to log onto the forum without luck and finally went to bed.
I have just tried to load TI 2013 and guess what I have TI 11 back although I fully uninstalled it and got rid of the TI 11 secure zone as I was afraid that 2013 might not recognize it and want to create a second Zone. I have to assume that Windows repair ran a system restore without any extra input from me. Anyway don't have time to uninstall and re-install just at the moment. I will do it later or would you prefer the report as it is with TI 11 re-instated.
To answer your question about Secure Zone: My old SZ was on 'C' main partion with the OS. and I replaced it in exactly the same place and size.
But something odd happened when I ran the unistall, I'll try to recall the events but please understand it is a little grey in my mind now.
Uninstall said it had found a SZ and gave option something like this, Did I want to leave as is, Did I want to distribute the space, or did I want delete the contents of the partition and leave unallocated space.
I chose re-allocate the space back to 'C' (were it had originally been taken) as I thought that was probably the safest way then I could start a new SZ a fresh. The uninstaller went through the motions and when finished said a reboot was needed. But when I looked at the partitions in Drive Mangnt the SZ was still there and active. I tied through the uninstaller 2 or 3 times but it always rebooted with the SZ still active, I then tried a couple of times using the program proper, just the same. I then wiped the SZ and the uninstaller worked. After installing 2013 I then re-activated the unallocated SZ and gave it to 2013.
Have to go now will do the report when I get back do you want it with TI 11 installed or TI 2013
Thanks for your help with this
James S
Just a quick reply to Tuttle then I must go. Thanks by the way for your interest.
You all need to understand that I am 69 and very much self taught on computers from magazines and forums.
I not asking for any special treatment but you'll have to be gentle with me (Ha Ha!)
It'll take me while to absorb that tuttle, but will scratch my head on that when I get back.
Gotta go catch you later maybe.
Thanks James
Quick rule of thumb: don't have external drive connected (or if a desktop model, not powered up) when you boot. If you need it, it can always be connected after boot. Depending on your BIOS boot priority and the particular system and drive, you may be able to leave it connected, but if having boot freeze issues then disconnecting is simpler.
RIGHT! A rule of thumb I have most definitely taken on board.
I would normally have Ex HDDs powered down just by default but the WD is permanently connected without a power switch because it auto sleeps.
I think it calls for a trip to Maplins and a purchase of suitable switch and power connectors. Bit awkward scrubbing about pulling the power lead with these desks that have built in PC housings.
My next post will answer your previous comment Tuttle and the way I suspect it may go, I'm thinking, may sound as if I am at odds with what you are saying.
I am not I am just trying to provide an answer and learn along the way.
Thanks for that
James.
- Your BIOS has USB boot as higher priority, yet there is no bootable system on the WD drive so the boot cannot proceed.
OR
- The WD drive is one that includes optional security/encryption. Such drives have a VCD (Virtual CD) partition, which your system recognizes as a CD drive. Boot is encountering that VCD first, but it is not bootable so the boot cannot proceed.
With great respect Tuttle what you may have missed is that I had checked the boot order before using the new 2013 boot disc and I had also tried other boot discs, which worked and allowed system re boot without problem. Plus the new 2013 boot disc also booted normally as well and seemed to be working OK, the problem only started when I closed and ejected that disc.
Although to be honest I am now beginning to doubt my own recollection of what did actually happen. (Not to mention my sanity.)
But that aside I have now plugged in the same Ext Drive without any changes to it or the BIOS and the machine boots normally again. Therefore I have to assume that it was not solely down to USBs position in the Boot order which was preventing system boot unless the Acronis CD changed something.
But then when I originally checked the boot order I guess I would have only been checking that the optical drive was before the HDD, and now with the mist of battle from 3 days ago fogging my memory I am beginning to wonder if USB was also before HDD, but even if it was, if no bootable media is found by the BIOS in the USBs or optical drives shouldn't the BIOS just move on down the boot order until it reaches the HDD. Or have I got that wrong?
I have taken your point like pole axe between the eyes about the possibility of this VCD thing on this Western Digital although if so it hasn't caused any hang before and I have had the old TI 11 boot disc in and out more times than enough when I realised the TI 11 disc wasn't seeing the SATA drives.
So, it seemed to my simple way of thinking that, because there was no bootable media before the HDD and the Boot sequence would not progress past POST then it had to be that the TI 2013 boot disc that had in some way altered the MBR or something and that's where I gave up in case I made matters worse.
It was only when I closed the Acronis Boot disc and tried to reboot normally that the hang at the Asus (POST) screen occurred. It hadn't happened prior to that or since and there have been no changes to the BIOS or anything else apart from installing TI 2013 and creating a new Acronis Secure Zone.
I don't know about this VCD thing, I've been trying to find documentation but I've had it about 18 months or more. Like I said it has always booted OK and I have never invoked any security or even recall that there was anything by way of documentation regarding VCD. But that doesn't mean it hasn't got VCD of course.
regards
James
(PS did I mention that the BIOS is UEFI don't now if that might make some difference)
Hello Everyone,
Thank you for your comments and your help James F.
James S, in addition to James' valuable suggestions, could you please let us know if you created an Acronis Secure Zone on an external hard drive? In addition, could you attach the following report called Acronis report 51?
Please let me know if you have additional questions.
Thank you.
Hello Anton,
I am about to attach the report.
I hope I answered your question about Acronis Secure Zone in the earlier post. After the boot problem and the Window's start up repairer launched I am now back to TI 11 as explained in other post. So I don't know if you want the report with 11 installed or 2013 installed.
I have run it with TI 11 installed if you need it with TI 2013 installed I will cross everything and start again but I would prefer to hear your comments before I turn down that street again.
While I'm waiting for Anton to come back with his findings re. the report, could I ask if anybody could advise on the following.
You will see in post #5 that I uninstalled TI 11 before installing TI 2013 but the only way I could unistall was to take the 'leave the security Zone as an unallocated partition' option. Even coming out of the uninstaller and using the SZ manager I could not reallocate the SZ partition back to 'C' where it came from.
TI would just go through the motions of completing the task and when finished say it had completed the task successfully but nothing had changed. The SZ was still there in Disc Manager as an active partition. So the only way I could uninstall TI 11 was to make the SZ unallocated then reallocate it to 2013 once TI 11 was uninstalled.
But when I installed 2013 and gave the original SZ space to TI 2013 for it's SZ, even though I moved the SZ size slider over to maximum, it created a SZ that is a few Mbs smaller than the original, and I am now left with a partition that is a only 26Mbs in size and pretty much useless. Further, when I try to give this few Mbs of space to the newly created SZ using the SZ manager I am now told that the SZ is already set to its maximum.
My question is this. How would this effect running an Image back-up taken when I had the previous size of SZ as all my back-up images would be of the slightly larger SZ. Would the partitions be reverted to how they were, or would the image be written to the HDD as it now is leaving this silly little partition still showing or would the backup go horribly wrong and abort leaving me with no OS at all.
Getting a bit worried
James S
New backup images will save partition structure as it is now.
FYI:
I advise against creating the Secure Zone. It's really meant as a sub-optimal method of backup for people who have no external target to which to backup. If your drive fails, you would lose your system, files, and your Secure Zone backups.
It's much better and safer to make backup images to an external hard drive.
Also, in the past there were occasonal reports of the Secure Zone causing problems to the system. When I installed Secure Zone on one PC, it corrupted the hard drive causing data loss and rendering the system unbootable. Perhaps the latest versions of Secure Zone are improved, but that experience coupled with its inherent insecurity and lack of reduncancy cause me to be wary of Secure Zone.
I also recommend against the associated Startup Recovery Manager. If activated, it modifies your system drive Master Boot Record (MBR), which can cause problems with multi-boot managers and other low-level disk utilities.
Thanks for that Tuttle,
Being on a computer learning curve since retirement ( I was lucky in that an IT dept did all the technical fault stuff even when working from home) My recently acquired little knowledge made me wary of using the full options of Secure Zone. I didn't like the thought of the MBR being replaced with a custom one either so opted out of the start up manager. All my back ups do go to ext. HDD Drives.
I only use SZ for try and decide which has helped me enormously to better understand programs without clogging up the registry and the system with stuff.
I never really knew if I had made the right decision or not and it's very good to have you opinion, thank you. My back up policy is keeping 2 OS images (with current programs) backed-ups on external HDD 6 monthly interval, the older of the two back-ups being deleted as a new one is created. Current ongoing work and project files, snaps and home video projects etc go onto and are often worked on from a second Ext HDD. These are sorted six monthly and Archived on the other HDD with the System Images. The theory being that the HDD used to archive stuff and store the back-up system images should outlive the PC and the ext HDD which is in daily use. ( Being a worry wart I wish I hadn't said that last bit now)
Don't think I made myself clear re the back-ups and the size of the Secure Zone what I wanted to understand is:- As my partitions have now been changed slightly by 2013 in so much that it has created a tiny little empty partition of 26Mbs which is space from the old SZ Partition that it doesn't seem to want. If I decide to restore to one of the earlier images which had the TI 11 sized secure zone which was those 26Mb larger would the earlier Image restore OK and would the Partition sizes be back to what they were.
You see I have no experience or way of knowing if a System Image just replaces the OS as an installation disc might do or if the back-up Image is of the partitions as well and therefore whole HDD is returned to how it was including partition.
If you restore a full disk image including MBR, it replaces everything on the target disk: OS, installed programs, data, as well as partition structure.
Thank you Tuttle,
What I plan to do then is restore to a fairly recent Windows image which I took of the whole drive (as belts and braces) then I will uninstall TI 11, I guess I will have to leave the SZ unallocated as I did last time before it will uninstall. If so, I will then use W7 disc Mngmt to merge C with the Secure Zone space before installing TI 2013 again.
If you recall, when my PC did reboot after the hang at POST it automatically ran a repair at Windows start up and reverted to TI 11. It must have run a system restore or used last good configuration other wise if it had used an image there would have been lots of updating going on but nothing updated at all. So I will have to use the Windows Image because TI 11 can't see my SATA drives, internal or extension, which was what started this whole thing off and caused me to upgrade to 2013.
I do have Acronis Disc Director Suite 10 but from what I've read is its not good for 64bit systems and as the SZ Partition is contiguous and to the right of the main 'C' OS partition it should be straight forward to merge using W7 disc management.
Then I will cross my legs and fingers and install 2013 again but this time I will disconnect all USB drives before trying the boot disc.
All I need now is Anton to let me know if any anomaly has been found with the report as I am still puzzled why 3 other boot discs didn't cause this problem after being ejected, but the 2013 disc did and without any changes to the BIOS my machine is booting happily again.
Although I expect Anton has more than likely finished for the weekend. No sweat it can wait a day three.
Thanks again for your help it is very much appreciated.
Use a command from within True Image to disable the Secure Zone before you uninstall. Also disable Startup Recovery if you had enabled it.