Laptop bricked after installing ATI 2013 on Samsung Series 5 - no way to recover

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Yesterday we bought a new Samsung Series 5 ultrabook with Windows 8 pre-installed.
After setting up the machine with two Microsoft-Accounts and necessary software. I did install Acronis and let it download the latest version. I decided also to make an Acronis Secure zone partition. I did not make backups until now. But the install of ASZ worked perfectely. Laptop restarted without any problem.

But yesterday evening all of sudden the machine stopped working. After a sleep (closed lid) the machine did not resume.

I restarted the machine, which did not work. the machine is stuck in an endless loop op restarts. You can hear the HDD firing up, 1 second, and dead. It keeps on doing that, there only one way (!) to cut off the machine: take off the power cord and use the reset hole with a paperclip. Then it stops.
During boot, hitting F10 (Bios) is possible. Hitting F2 (setup) and F4 (samsung recover) do not work.

But I have the firm impression that this bricking has everything to do with Acronis being imcompatible with Secure Boot option on Windows 8, the UEFI implementation. That Acronis has somewhere left a trace during the installation process that causes the blocking.

I have to notice that I made a Acronis recovery USB stick with the desktop, and tried to fire up the Samsung from there. But there is no way in telling the Samsung Series 5 to boot up from the stick. The bios simply does not accept any alternative boot-options, even after disabling the secure boot option, and going over to CMS.

I'm thinking about returning the Samsung. Unless someone has a better idea?

Sun, 05/12/2013 - 08:51
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You said "hitting F10 (Bios) is possible" and yet "there is no way in telling...to boot from the stick" which implies you can NOT get in to BIOS?

Since it's brand-new I'd be inclined to take it back, especially as it doesn't even boot (even F4 not working).

What I would normally do with a new laptop is to pull the drive and make a True Image copy of it with another computer, in its pristine, never booted, brand-new state, though I must admit I'm not familiar with how "conventional BIOS vs. UEFI" works so don't know if one can scramble the BIOS such that your "pristine backup" would still be useless.

Someone here will know about that though I'm sure.

Sun, 05/12/2013 - 11:22
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I can indeed get into the boot menu. And the options I chose are effectively carried out (e.g. disable fast boot).
But I cannot get the secured boot off. Simply does not work.

"What I would normally do with a new laptop is to pull the drive and make a True Image copy of it with another computer, in its pristine, never booted, brand-new state, though I must admit I'm not familiar with how "conventional BIOS vs. UEFI" works so don't know if one can scramble the BIOS such that your "pristine backup" would still be useless."
+1

Me too. For once... i didn't.

Having a problem like this, I normally would pull the HDD out, hook it up to my desktop, and see If I can undo the secure zone, fix the mbr, etc etc... but the more I read about "secured boot" and GTP stuff, the less I'm inclined to try things myself.

Googling the issue, I can see that I'm far from the sole person with this issue. A lot of users got stuck with a Series 5 or 9. If it were for trying to install Linux, a dual boot, or a boot from stick or external HDD. More then occassionaly it comes back to a bricked laptop. So I think the problem is originated by Samsung. Some bad engineering? Don't know, but the solution lies probably with them.

I'll carry it back tomorrow.

Sun, 05/12/2013 - 12:37
truwrikodrorowrelupicugojestutroclulachosaswunuhospikigawakijosaswenomaruclojeueclikaspedrubewidebrisubrohutrurifruuagothunugekedrumucisiuobrobrecrupeslapuswosluprothethibakaslechurathikucli
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Gentlemen,

I also make a back up of a new notebooks drive prior to booting for the first time. I use Acronis Bootable Recovery Media. There is no need to remove the drive from the laptop for imaging.

@jutuiz, The start up recovery manager / ASZ does have merit for someone who is interested in recovering often, but I would not recommend using ASZ to protect a boot drive or partition since the backup is being saved to the same drive you are protecting. While this facilitates quick and easy restores, its not a good long term solution for someone who is looking for catastrophic recovery protection.

I'm not sure if this even applies to your situation, but build #5551 has a patch for win8 machines that are using Secure Boot.

Builds #6514 and later already include this fix.

Sun, 05/12/2013 - 13:46
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truwrikodrorowrelupicugojestutroclulachosaswunuhospikigawakijosaswenomaruclojeueclikaspedrubewidebrisubrohutrurifruuagothunugekedrumucisiuobrobrecrupeslapuswosluprothethibakaslechurathikucli
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Jutuiz,

You have mentioned whether the recovery environment on your USB stick is that of build 6514 or 5551. If it isn't 6514 which includes the W8 patch, I suggest downloading the ISO from your account and making a new copy of the recovery environment. If the Ultrabook has a CD drive or you can find an external CD drive, this might be the best bet at the moment.

Once you can boot from the Recovery CD/USB you will be able to deactivate the ASRM. If the recovery environment won't boot the Ultrabook or starts to boot and then fails at loading True Image there are further options to try.

There is one other thing to try, if you have access to a disk management utility and can boot from it, check that the drive is still marked as 'Active', it might be that the 'Active' flag has been deactivated which will prevent booting.

To other people reading this thread. It is advisable to test the bootability of any system using the recovery media before enabling the Acronsi Startup and Recovery Manager, if the CD/USB recovery media fails to boot the system, the ASRM definitely won't work either. The recovery environment might be persuaded to work, but there is no way to persuade the ASRM to work if it has a problem.

Sun, 05/12/2013 - 19:55
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truwrikodrorowrelupicugojestutroclulachosaswunuhospikigawakijosaswenomaruclojeueclikaspedrubewidebrisubrohutrurifruuagothunugekedrumucisiuobrobrecrupeslapuswosluprothethibakaslechurathikucli
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Hello Colin,

Thank you for regarding into this.

Environment on stick & both laptop = indeed 6514.
No CD-drive in ultrabook.
The BIOS does not allow me in any way to boot from external device (HDD, USB, external CD/DVD station).

My hope was indeed to startup from USB and check properties of HDD.

My second thoughts on installing ASRM and even Acronis Secure Zone was that in this case it was overkill on this laptop. Just installing ATI with a backup to my external Hdd would have done the trick.

Never had a system that was not able to boot from CD/DVD; stick. So never looked into it.
Googling the issue learns that dual-booting a Series 5 or removing W8 and installing Linux gives similar major problems.

Keep you posted on the solution.

Sun, 05/12/2013 - 20:13
truwrikodrorowrelupicugojestutroclulachosaswunuhospikigawakijosaswenomaruclojeueclikaspedrubewidebrisubrohutrurifruuagothunugekedrumucisiuobrobrecrupeslapuswosluprothethibakaslechurathikucli
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@jutuiz,
The high number of reported unrecoverable failures would prompt me to reconsider this purchase. When software can brick a piece of hardware the design itself needs to be revisited. I'm fairly certain your LT will need to go back to Samsung for repair/UEFI reflash. If it were me and the option to return was available, I'd exercise that option. I might be willing to reconsider after I was certain this defect was repaired.

Mon, 05/13/2013 - 05:01
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truwrikodrorowrelupicugojestutroclulachosaswunuhospikigawakijosaswenomaruclojeueclikaspedrubewidebrisubrohutrurifruuagothunugekedrumucisiuobrobrecrupeslapuswosluprothethibakaslechurathikucli
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Hi Jutuiz,
I had a new Samsung laptop with I7 and eufi booting, and I had exaclty the same problem with the bios only seeing secure boot mode. I could find anyway of enabling legacy mode. Once the system go entangled, there was no way out of it. I took the PC back to John Lewis, and they have a good PC technical department. They couldn't recover it and agreed a full refund.

So I would take it back and if they challenge you, hold firm - a pc should not break when you install back-up software.

Do not accept a replacement - choose a different brand and test it can boot into legacy mode. if not - don't touch.

I have since bought a Sony Vaio (similar price/quailty range as Samsung), which itself has some quirks, but its own (not acronis) recovery software is very good to put pc back to original state, assuming you create the recovery disks (or better USB).

It is easily booted into legacy mode (one of its quirks is when you create acronis recovery disks even using the hot patch is that it always seems to need legacy mode to boot i.e the hot patch to allow eufi boot does not work with it). This is a minor inconvenience.

With Sony, I have found full disk backup (in disk mode) works best (see caution note nelow)

I also back up C drive only as a partition backup in case I have to recover PC to original state, and then simply reinstall C partition to bring up to date. This assumes you have not made major changes that would affect bios etc.

Caution: latest version of acronis has bug with uefi disks as boot disk cannot see them. My experience is Win_PE4 disk created using previous acronis version works best. Read forum for more details.

Mon, 05/13/2013 - 08:28
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Beginner
Posts: 1
Comments: 4

Hallo everbody.

I got a phonecall yesterday: I get a full refund and can choose another laptop. Pity that it took 2 weeks for the retailer to come up with the solution. In the main time I see that the Series 5 has dissapeared from their online shop. Curious if it is still in the shop...

To colin B: "It is advisable to test the bootability of any system using the recovery media before enabling the Acronsi Startup and Recovery Manager, if the CD/USB recovery media fails to boot the system, the ASRM definitely won't work either. The recovery environment might be persuaded to work, but there is no way to persuade the ASRM to work if it has a problem. "
+ 1
totally agree, I should have done this, but anyhow... this is an new issue for me. Until now could not foresee this kind of problem.

To shadowsports: ", The start up recovery manager / ASZ does have merit for someone who is interested in recovering often, but I would not recommend using ASZ to protect a boot drive or partition since the backup is being saved to the same drive you are protecting. While this facilitates quick and easy restores, its not a good long term solution for someone who is looking for catastrophic recovery protection."
+ 1
agree too, in a total disaster scenario a ASZ on the same physical desk is no help either. But ASZ saves tons of time for the quick recovery.

This said, and after reading much about EUFI-problems in combination W8 + Acronis, means that I am very reluctant to install Acronis on any another W8 laptop. ATI 2013 works very well on my main W8 desktop and on my Lenovo laptop (W7pro), both without ASZ anyway, but this experience leaves me with very mixed feelings. Whoever is to blame here, Samsung or Acronis, I feel I should have got a warning message somehow while installing the system or starting up ASZ. Security-software equals peace of mind and saving time. For all I can say now, it's rather the opposite.

Thanks everybody for your help, much appreciated.

Sun, 05/26/2013 - 08:17