Backup of "Files and Folders" slows as selections are checked using Windows 7 Home 32 bit
Selecting various files and folders and adding them to the backup starts out working fine but as more data is selected and added the program gets slower and slower. By slower I mean it takes more time for the check mark to appear in the selection box. For example, if I click on 5 boxes it may take up to 30 seconds before the checks appear so I can continue. Then at some point the checks will no longer appear in the boxes and I am not able to add any more files. Today I used the online support chat and the tech worked on my system remotely for over two hours and could not find a cause or solution. He finally created several log files and uploaded them for further review. As it stands, this option is non-functional on my system. The standard backup which creates a disk image works fine. I currently use an obsolete 2009 GFI program to do a daily backup of important data files and Macrium to make a disk image monthly. I was hoping to use Acronis True Image 2019 to replace those programs.
My system is Windows 7 Home 32-bit using a normal NTFS file system. ATI 2019 starts slowing severely while selecting data files three sub-folders deep. So the files are not deeply nested at all. It's very strange. It seems like ATI is running out of resources. My task manager indicates about 50% CPU usage and 1 GB of memory. My computer runs an Intel P4 processor and 4 GB of memory. All of my other programs run fine.
Thanks for the further information George. I am not in a position to be able to test this issue directly as no longer have any 32-bit Windows 7 systems other than a very old IBM laptop with a non-pae processor which has ATI 2016 installed and only 2GB memory.
I do have a 32-bit Windows 10 box which I can try (once I reboot it from Ubuntu into Windows and let it go through all its update hoops!), not sure if it has ATI 2018 or 2019 until I check it.
I believe Acronis is either using Windows indexing (or something proprietary, but similar in nature for the purpose of identifying what is in those folders) and this can be resource intensive, the farther you drive into folders, or the larger the # of files grows as well. The thing though, is once the items are selected and saved to the backup script, you shouldn't need to go through this again, unless specifically picking more, new folders and using the same backup script.
Although I'm sure it does fine in many day to day operations, it's old and out-dated (well beyond the reasonable lifetime of industry hardware) and wouldn't invest time trying to trouble shoot this unless someone really feels inclined to.
Hate to say it, but your system is a bit of slouch - especially only being 32-bit and topping out with 4GB of ancient memory and a processor that was made somewhere between 2000-2008, making it a minimum of 11 years old and likely older, plus an OS that is on its deathbed for support.
You're running modern applications (and backup programs are integrated deeply with the OS based on the need for permissions/access and use of embedded services such as indexing and VSS). I would say Acronis 2019 is a bit more resource intensive than other applications, especially when running in conjunction with antivirus and malware protection programs and Acronis Active Protection.
Also, FYI for your personal benefit and data security, Windows 7 is EOL in 9 months. It might be time to bite the bullet and look at upgrading to something a bit newer and running Windows 10. Not only is Win7 going EOL, but it has some nasty zero-day vulnerabilities right now (luckily with patches that just came out), but with many more likely being saved for when Microsoft stops supporting it with security patches and updates.
Personally, as far as the forum goes, I'm pretty much done offering personal time for Windows 7 support as encouraging it's continued use, is not something I feel is in the best interest of data backup and security. Instead, we should be encouraging people to start planning for their OS (and in cases like this hardware) upgrades.
Here are some references about the EOL for Win 7 and the recent Win 7 zero day exploits that recently came to light.
https://www.your-itdepartment.co.uk/news/why-you-need-to-prepare-for-windows-7-end-of-life/
https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/windowsforbusiness/end-of-windows-7-support
https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/help/13853/windows-lifecycle-fact-sheet
https://www.zdnet.com/article/proof-of-concept-code-published-for-windows-7-zero-day/
Steve & Bobbo,
I totally agree with you assessment of the problem. Would turning "indexing" off help speed it up?
Yes, I am fully aware of the EOL of Windows 7 in Jan 2020. And you are correct, this old desktop has about outlived it usefulness. I just sent an email to Parteek, the support engineer, asking him not to put too much effort into resolving the issue with ATI 2019. He has been very supportive and helpful but I don't want to waste his time either.
I am in the process of building a new desktop computer with Windows 10 64-bit OS. I am pretty certain that when I install ATI 2019 on the new system, it will run just fine. This will be a screamingly fast computer, but not a gaming system. I'm only going to use the onboard GPU built into the Intel I-5 CPU. Here are the specs of the new build:
System:
Motherboard: Gigabyte Z390 Gaming M Micor ATX
CPU: Intel Core i5-9600K 3.7 GHz (no overclock)
Memory: G-Skill Ripjaws V Series 16 GB DDR4-2666
NVMEs: Samsung 970 Evo Plus 500 GB M.2-2280 SSD
SSDs: Samsung 860 Evo 500 GB storage drive
HDs: None
OS: Windows 10 Home x64
George, glad to hear it - at least you're already planning for the future and willing to accept change (other people, not so much - it's amazing how many people in the forums buy brand new computers and want to clone their old win7 systems to them even now). It's not fun to start on a new system, but sometimes, you just need to to update technology or to clean out the gremlins from years of wear and tear.
Your new build looks great. I don't game either and only use the embedded graphics in the chipset and it works great for me - still get 1080P on a 27" monitor and things like Netflix and Youtube look fine.
I really don't know if turning off indexing will help or not. If you're willing to try though, would be interesting to hear the results. I have a feeling that if you have Acronis Active Protection (AAP) enabled, it may be slowing things down as well. Good ransomware protection, but might be taxing the old hardware a bit.
Hello Jack,
Yes, it does act like Acronis True Image 2019 is using a lot of resources when selecting "Files & Folders". Even on my new desktop build, it seems to slow down as more files are selected, and my new system is a screamer regarding speed. It will boot to the desktop in under 15 seconds.
Like Bobbo stated, once all the files and folders needed to be backed up are selected, then there is no further issue with speed. So it's not a deal breaker by any means. After having used Windows 10 64-bit for a few months, I like it very much and it is faster and more secure than Windows 7. Didn't take me long to adapt to the new Windows 10 OS.
Geo
Bobbo, you wanted me to let you know if deselecting the indexing on the drive helped with speed. I have that feature disabled on my NVMe SSD but I cannot say that it improved the speed of ATI 2019 when selecting "Files & Folders". It does eliminated some unneeded reads and writes to the SSD though, which is a good thing.
Now, for another little snafu. I use Outlook Express as my email client on Windows 10 64-bit. The code on this old email client has been modified to run on Windows 7, 8, & 10. I still feel that OE is the best and simplest email client and it runs just fine on my Windows 10 system. The problem is that one of the files that I backup regularly is the Geo .wab address book file with all of my contacts. This file resides in C:\Users\Geo\AppData\Roaming\Microsoft\Address Book folder. Even though I select this file for backup, Acronis True Image 2019 ignores it, as well as any other files in the Microsoft folder. Consequently, I have to remember to manually backup my address book file occasionally. I have contacted Acronis support but they do not have a remedy for this issue. They stated that ATI was not able to backup certain files because of Windows protections on the folders.
I've had to experiment with ATI backup configurations to simplify the backups. When selecting the "incremental" option there are too many chains stored in the drive. Even using the "differential" option, there ends up being too many files and chains. When I do a partition backup of the C: drive, I select the "single version scheme" to make it simple. I find searching through several chains to find the version of the file I want to recover is sort of complicated and time consuming. I like to use the "KISS" method of doing things. I've been using ATI 2019 for a few months now and I am still trying to find the best backup schemes to use which do not fill my backup drives with an excessive number of files, or consume too much space on the drive.
These are just some idiosyncrasies I have found as a first time user of Acronis True Image 2019.
Geo
George,
Sorry to hear that the file/folder backup is not any faster with recovery :( I'd normally say to do a partition backup instead so that you could mount the volume as a drive letter and explore it that way, but you can't do that with a file/folder backup. If you backup the entire drive (or partition) regularly with another backup job, you should be able to then mount it and copy and paste the file out of there.
I don't think it's windows protection that's the issue. The problem is likely that VSS (volume shadow service) which is the tool used by Windows to take a live backup (a snapshot) of the OS while it is in use, is configured to not backup certain files by default from Microsoft. Some of those include certain Outlook files!
You might try modifying the registry in this case, then taking a backup and seeing if it is included then.
Open regedit with admin access...
navigate to
HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Control\BackupRestore\FilesNotToSnapshot
and
HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\ControlSet001\Control\BackupRestore\FilesNotToBackup
Look for an entry related to the OE address book or related file extension or path and remove it.
FYI, make sure to export the registry key first, in case you need/want to import it back later. Mucking with the registry can cause unintended consequences if you accidentally start modifying the wrong keys.
You may also like the new incremental method in ATI 2020... it's one backup .tibx file now and all of the incrementals live in that one file. You'll still have multiple versions of the .tibx if you have multiple chains, but the frequency of new chains is based on the # of incrementals you select before a new full must be created. If you're backing up daily, you could set the limit to 13 incrementals (basically 2 weeks) and then keep only a couple of weeks worth of chains...
i.e.
14 days = 1 chain. 3 chains = roughly 1 and 1/2 months of retention. The next full completes and old chain #1 is automatically removed. That wouldn't be too bad.
And I just read that you are doing a partition backup from time to time... so you could try mounting that as a volume and seeing if copy and paste out of it is faster than the the other way directly in explorer.
Bobbo,
Thank you for your response, and suggesting to modify the registry keys. I searched both of those keys but there was no mention of Outlook Express or any *.wab files. So it's still a mystery as to why my Geo.wab address book file is not being backed up in the "Files & Folders" selection. Now that I know this, I just manually copy the file to my external backup drive when any changes are made to it. It is a little glitch in the ATI 2019 program though, which because of my OCD, I would still like to know the reason.
I haven't looked at the new ATI 2020 yet. Sounds like there have been some improvements.
Geo
George,
Bummer. Perhaps another suggestion... Could you create a new test file/folder backup and point it only to that specific file and see if it backs it up? If it does (hopefully), then you may just need to go back into the source and select the entire folder again (at the top there is a check box that will select the entire folder and all included files by default). It's possible that the file was not there originally or that only individual files were selected in the folder before it was created so it's not included? Just a guess - maybe not.
Hopefully that new test backup will get it though, or confirm if there is an issue not backing up .wab files for some reason.
Bobbo,
As suggested, I created a new "Files and Folders" backup named test backup. Then I opened the source and selected the Address Book folder only. I set the schedule to backup 15 minutes later and closed Acronis. Later I opened Windows explorer and checked the test backup for the *.wab files, and yes, they were backed up correctly.
Then I opened Acronis and chose the "Files and Folders" Backup. The Address Book folder with the *.wab files was checked as it should have been. Then I went back up to the Microsoft folder and checked the box to include all of the sub-folders, which included the Address Book folder.
Then I selected the "Run Backup Now" and closed Acronis True Image. I opened Windows explorer to my backup drive and mounted the backup which I had just run. The Microsoft folder was included in the backup this time along with all of the sup-folders, including the Address Book folder with my contacts (Geo.wab) file.
I do not understand why Acronis would not backup the single Address Book sub-folder of the Microsoft folder until I selected all of the remaining folders though. The Microsoft folder is only 84MB so it's not taking much additional space on the backup drive in any case. If the folders continue to be backed up then the issue is solved with this workaround. Thank you for continuing to suggest ideas until we arrived at a solution. It's still kind of quirky though.
Geo
George,
Thanks for testing and I'm glad the end result is that it's now backing up too!
If it was showing as selected before, I would expect it to have been included too.
If you want to try one more test, deselect the folder and just select the files you need in it and see if it captures it still, or goes back to the earlier behavior.
I'm guessing it will back it up correctly, but only one way to find out.
I don't know what may have happened to cause this behavior, but re-picking the source or destination is often an easy fix. And if you can back up the entire folder, that should ensure any changes within it will be captured too (like new files that may get added later with updates or something).
Bobbo,
Okay, just for curiosity I did the last test you requested. I deselected the Microsoft folder and then selected only the Address Book files. Then I ran "Back up Now" to create a new backup with only those *.wab files selected. I closed ATI and opened Windows explorer to see if the files had backed up. Nope, right back to not including the selected Address Book folder and *.wab files. In fact, the parent Microsoft folder was excluded.
Then I opened ATI and again selected the Microsoft folder and checked the box to include all sub-folders. Then ran another "Back up now" process. Opened Windows explorer and the last backup included the Microsoft folder and all it's sub-folders, including the Address Book folder. The Microsoft folder with ALL sub-folders selected is the only option to back up the Address Book.
"I'm guessing it will back it up correctly, but only one way to find out."
So now you know. This was for your information mostly, and it did not work as you thought that it might. Hope this information is a help to you.
Geo
Geo,
Thanks for humoring me. Wow, I'm not sure what's up with that. I don't have any specific .wab files to test with so just tried some similar scenarios and had no issues selecting individual files from things like my Google Chrome default profile (individual files like history and bookmarks). I did make a fake .wab file by just creating the same folder structure and renaming a .txt file to .wab and that went ok too.
And seeing as how it did work with a new backup job in your earlier test (via a new backup job) I can only somehow assume that the existing backup job has an underlying issue that only Acronis might be able to identify with a ticket and a system report. Thankfully, it seems to be working for the majority of other files in the original backup and if you select the main Microsoft folder and all subfolders, but you shouldn't have to do that.
In this case, you may want to consider just creating a new backup job for files/folders again and working with that as it does seem to clear up the issue and may be more reliable moving forward. You could do this and keep the existing backup files for a period of time if you need the recovery history and then delete them down the road to free up space if need be. Maybe something was leftover from an earlier installation of True Image that didn't quite convert? I'm not really sure.
The only thing else that comes to mind is if the original backup, after you just select the specific .wab file without the root Microsoft folder and then press "run backup now" (which is what saves the change) if that works. And if not, when you go back to edit the backup, but don't modify it, does the top folder have a check box in it or not? I notice that when I am selecting the source and just pick specific files, it is not selected, but once I run the backup and then go back in and check it, it is selected.
Bobbo,
Gee...you went to a lot of trouble creating those folders and testing on your system to see if ATI would backup those *.wab files. Thank you for the extra effort to find a solution, it is appreciated.
Per your last paragraph, when I only selected the *.wab files they were not included. When I went back and looked at the Microsoft parent folder it did have the box checked as it should and the Microsoft folder was shaded. Oh, and by the way, this is a fresh desktop computer build and my first time installing and using ATI 2019. So, no previous ATI installs.
Okay now for the remedy, I did as you suggested in the second paragraph. This took a little time to complete but I edited the "Test Folder" to include all of the same files and folders that were being backed up in the original "Files and Folders" backup. I mounted the last backup from the original folder and expanded it so I could be sure to select all of the same files and folders in the "Test" folder. Once I was sure the "Test" backup included all of the necessary files, I ran the "Back up now" option. Then I opened Windows explorer to verify that the *.wab files had backed up, and YES, everything backed up correctly.
Next, I renamed the original backup to "Files & Folders Old" and changed the destination to a renamed folder on my backup drive. Then I renamed the "Test" folder to "Files & Folders". I wanted to schedule a fresh full backup in that folder so I ran "clean up versions..." to remove the test backup done previously. This morning I checked the backup and a new full backup was run successfully at 3:00 AM. I checked the backup and all the files and folders were backed up along with the Microsoft and Address Book folders with the *.wab files. Yeah!
Apparently, something was corrupted in the original "Files & Folders" backup, which I deleted today. So, we have finally gotten ATI 2019 working just as it should. This was a very peculiar problem but at least now we know how to correct it. Thanks for hanging with me to find a real solution to the problem. BTW, when will ATI 2020 be available? Would a special upgrade price be available if I were to choose to upgrade to ATI 2020?
Have a great day!
Geo
Geo,
Happy to help and I'm glad that we finally have a final and working solution! Software isn't perfect (trust me, I have at least 5 licensed versions of different products and a few free ones) that I use for testing, comparison and to provide variation of backups, just in case .Don't get me wrong, Acronis is pretty darn reliable (and generally my go-to and only stop for recovery), but it's still software and just like our Windows OS can eventually start having issues, we sometimes see it in our backup programs too.
Take care!