TI or MVP builder cannot see drives or TI USB external disk -- Win7 Intel RAID
Goal: Move from Win7 to Win10 and make sure my TI backups are available in case something goes wrong.
I am having very uncomfortable luck with TI 2020 in creating bootable USB|CD using
* Rescue Media (WinPE or Linux) or
* Acronis Universal Restore
* Survival Kit (can't copy error) or
the MVP ATIPE Win tool. [The Linux one sees all my disk but then freeze on that dialog screen.]
I have Intel RAID 1 with my "C:" being a SSD and my "D:" being a normal drive. I suspect that I need to do custom drivers for the Intel RAID but it is very frustrating and odd to me that not of the above methods do this automatically since they are part of the existing system. Certainly I'm naive about how hard this is. It is not clear at all how to get the drivers off my system and into the right places to get a reliable TI bootable USB|CD which will recover files from my USB attached 4TB backup drive and rebuild my Disk0/1(C:) and/or Disk2/3(D:) setup.
If someone could point me in the right direction I would appreciate it!
Below some cut-n-paste from a HD reporting tool (also attached for more details). Also below is the log from the MVP ATIPE builder
Belt-n-suspenders (ie. multiple backups before win7->win10 attempt) is to use clonezilla (or the Windows backup build in?).
Physical Disk Information - Disk: #0: Corsair Force GS
Hard Disk Summary
Hard Disk Number | : | 0 | |
Interface | : | Intel RAID #0/0 [11/0 (0)] | |
Disk Controller | : | Intel(R) C600+/C220+ series chipset SATA RAID Controller (RAID) [VEN: 8086, DEV: 2826] Version: 3.8.0.1108, 9-3-2013 | |
Disk Location | : | Bus Number 6, Target Id 1, LUN 0 | |
Hard Disk Model ID | : | Corsair Force GS | |
Firmware Revision | : | 5.24 | |
Hard Disk Serial Number | : | 1346790200009986021E | |
SSD Controller | : | SandForce SF-2281VB1 | |
Total Size | : | 228936 MB | |
Power State | : | Active | |
Logical Drive(s) | : | C: [] |
Physical Disk Information - Disk: #2: WDC WD1000DHTZ-04N21V1
Hard Disk Summary
Hard Disk Number | : | 2 | |
Interface | : | Intel RAID #1/0 [11/0 (1)] | |
Disk Controller | : | Intel(R) C600+/C220+ series chipset SATA RAID Controller (RAID) [VEN: 8086, DEV: 2826] Version: 3.8.0.1108, 9-3-2013 | |
Disk Location | : | Bus Number 6, Target Id 2, LUN 0 | |
Hard Disk Model ID | : | WDC WD1000DHTZ-04N21V1 | |
Firmware Revision | : | 04.06A01 | |
Hard Disk Serial Number | : | WD-WX71EA3DANF4 | |
Total Size | : | 953869 MB | |
Power State | : | Active | |
Logical Drive(s) | : | D: [] |
02-27-2020 10.32.31 START injecting Windows 7 CUSTOM 64-bit drivers - USER selected.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Deployment Image Servicing and Management tool
Version: 10.0.14393.0
Image Version: 6.1.7600.16385
Searching for driver packages to install...
Found 8 driver package(s) to install.
Installing 1 of 8 - G:\Drivers_Custom\x64_Windows_7\ASMedia USB 3.0\amstxhci.inf: The driver package was successfully installed.
Installing 2 of 8 - G:\Drivers_Custom\x64_Windows_7\ASMedia USB 3.0\asmthub3.inf: The driver package was successfully installed.
Installing 3 of 8 - G:\Drivers_Custom\x64_Windows_7\Intel USB 3.0\iusb3hub.inf: The driver package was successfully installed.
Installing 4 of 8 - G:\Drivers_Custom\x64_Windows_7\Intel USB 3.0\iusb3xhc.inf: The driver package was successfully installed.
Installing 5 of 8 - G:\Drivers_Custom\x64_Windows_7\IRST\iaAHCIC.inf: The driver package was successfully installed.
Installing 6 of 8 - G:\Drivers_Custom\x64_Windows_7\IRST\iaStorAC.inf: The driver package was successfully installed.
Installing 7 of 8 - G:\Drivers_Custom\x64_Windows_7\NIC\Killer e2200 Gigabit Ethernet Controller\oem59.inf: The driver package was successfully installed.
Installing 8 of 8 - G:\Drivers_Custom\x64_Windows_7\Samsung NVMe\secnvme.inf: The driver package was successfully installed.
The operation completed successfully.
Anhang | Größe |
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Hard Disk Sentinel.pdf | 182.1 KB |


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Thanks Steve. When I was reading about MVP Custom WinPE that was one of the things that caught my eye. I thought I picked that option. Let me try it again after some caffeine. I was up late working on this and then got up and tried again. I've tried a lot of things and do have high hopes for the MVP Custom WinPE!
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Steve Smith wrote:Scott, try creating the MVP Custom WinPE version of the rescue media and select to inject the Custom Drivers which will automatically add in the necessary Intel RST drivers for RAID support and NVMe drives.
Well I have the same results. I *only* see Boot Drive X. Here is some info backs up my actions. TIA for any guidance as to why my harddisk and the USB attached ATI backup disk does not show up in the WinPE environment !!
From my initial post above (repeated quote below) I do see the same IRST installing lines in the log (attached).
Installing 5 of 8 - G:\Drivers_Custom\x64_Windows_7\IRST\iaAHCIC.inf: The driver package was successfully installed.
Installing 6 of 8 - G:\Drivers_Custom\x64_Windows_7\IRST\iaStorAC.inf: The driver package was successfully installed.
I took this screen capture from 30 minutes ago when I redid the MVP builder which also shows I selected option 1 to 'inject' them:
Anhang | Größe |
---|---|
530980-179936.log | 29.29 KB |
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Scott,
I'm not clear on what drives the WinPE media can see. I know it can't see your RAID drives. Can it see your D: and external USB drives?
Please post some screenshots from Device Manager in Windows 7. Expand Software Controllers and show me that. Then show me the Properties/Drivers tab/Drivers Driver Details button results from the RAID controller. Make sure to list all the files shown. Also Proerties/Details tab and click on the drop down arrow next to the Properties line and scroll down and click on Inf name.
Once we have that information we'll plan on how to proceed with building the MVP Tool.
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Mustang wrote:Scott,
I'm not clear on what drives the WinPE media can see. I know it can't see your RAID drives. Can it see your D: and external USB drives?
Please post some screenshots from Device Manager in Windows 7. Expand Software Controllers and show me that. Then show me the Properties/Drivers tab/Drivers Driver Details button results from the RAID controller. Make sure to list all the files shown. Also Proerties/Details tab and click on the drop down arrow next to the Properties line and scroll down and click on Inf name.
Once we have that information we'll plan on how to proceed with building the MVP Tool.
Huge thanks. I believe I gathered all that you asked for and some overview screens.
WinPE can only see the drive I booted up in. I used my phone to take that image.
* My C: is my SSD RAID "os"
* My D: is my normal usage RAID (document, swapfile, etc) drive.
* My F: is a USB connected 4TB drive that I put all my backups on.
* My G: and H: in the 'Disk Management' screen below are my MVP builder USB and the MVP WinPE boot USB
I included all the details you asked for including the USB drivers information as well.
I downloaded DriverView (https://www.nirsoft.net/utils/driverview.html) and provided that export as an attachment. It would have details of the screens I captures I think. It appears I can add that as an 'extra' on the WinPE in the right directory. Most of this is pretty fair beyond my current knowledge but I'm trying to learn and be helpful in this process. I'm more of a user of my PC now-a-days than my youth when I used to get my hands 'dirty'. I can learn tho ... I have some healthy paranoia as I'm afraid of breaking something.
Anhang | Größe |
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530990-179957.txt | 139.11 KB |
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Mustang wrote:Scott,
I'm not clear on what drives the WinPE media can see. I know it can't see your RAID drives. Can it see your D: and external USB drives?
Please post some screenshots from Device Manager in Windows 7. Expand Software Controllers and show me that. Then show me the Properties/Drivers tab/Drivers Driver Details button results from the RAID controller. Make sure to list all the files shown. Also Proerties/Details tab and click on the drop down arrow next to the Properties line and scroll down and click on Inf name.
Once we have that information we'll plan on how to proceed with building the MVP Tool.
Huge thanks. I believe I gathered all that you asked for and some overview screens.
WinPE can only see the drive I booted up in. I used my phone to take that image.
* My C: is my SSD RAID "os"
* My D: is my normal usage RAID (document, swapfile, etc) drive.
* My F: is a USB connected 4TB drive that I put all my backups on.
* My G: and H: in the 'Disk Management' screen below are my MVP builder USB and the MVP WinPE boot USB
I included all the details you asked for including the USB drivers information as well.
I downloaded DriverView (https://www.nirsoft.net/utils/driverview.html) and provided that export as an attachment. It would have details of the screens I captures I think. It appears I can add that as an 'extra' on the WinPE in the right directory. Most of this is pretty fair beyond my current knowledge but I'm trying to learn and be helpful in this process. I'm more of a user of my PC now-a-days than my youth when I used to get my hands 'dirty'. I can learn tho ... I have some healthy paranoia as I'm afraid of breaking something.
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Mustang wrote:Scott,
I'm not clear on what drives the WinPE media can see. I know it can't see your RAID drives. Can it see your D: and external USB drives?
Please post some screenshots from Device Manager in Windows 7. Expand Software Controllers and show me that. Then show me the Properties/Drivers tab/Drivers Driver Details button results from the RAID controller. Make sure to list all the files shown. Also Proerties/Details tab and click on the drop down arrow next to the Properties line and scroll down and click on Inf name.
Once we have that information we'll plan on how to proceed with building the MVP Tool.
Huge thanks. I believe I gathered all that you asked for and some overview screens.
WinPE can only see the drive I booted up in. I used my phone to take that image.
* My C: is my SSD RAID "os"
* My D: is my normal usage RAID (document, swapfile, etc) drive.
* My F: is a USB connected 4TB drive that I put all my backups on.
* My G: and H: in the 'Disk Management' screen below are my MVP builder USB and the MVP WinPE boot USB
I included all the details you asked for including the USB drivers information as well.
I downloaded DriveView and provided that export as an attachment. It would have details of the screens I captures I think. It appears I can add that as an 'extra' on the WinPE in the right directory. Most of this is pretty fair beyond my current knowledge but I'm trying to learn and be helpful in this process. I'm more of a user of my PC now-a-days than my youth when I used to get my hands 'dirty'. I can learn tho ... I have some healthy paranoia as I'm afraid of breaking something.
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I see that the system appears to have an X79 chipset with an c600/c220 SATA controller. This can be described as venerable hardware (the Windows 7 driver is dated 2013), that supports Xeon CPUs. It is critical that the correct RAID drivers are installed, as newer Intel RIST do not work with some older hardware. I notice there is also a Marvel 91xx controller - is this on the motherboard or is it on a PCIe card. It appears that there is nothing attached to this controller. Are you loading drivers for this controller? If not try including them. Not sure why it should make any difference, but it could.
Ian
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Great screenshots.
Hers's what I think. The IRST driver included in the MVP Tool should be correct. We will need a driver for the Marvell91XX controller. Also, there is probably a driver conflict between one of the drivers included in the MVP Tool and one of the controllers on your motherboard. This could make all drives disappear in WinPE.
1. Go to the Drivers_Custom\x64_Windows_7 folder and MOVE the following folders to a temp location. This will eliminate them from the build.
2. Go Back to Device Manger and look at the Properties of the Marvell91XX controller. Get the list of files from the Driver Files Details window and the inf file name. Create a new folder in Drivers_Custom\x64_Windows_7 named Marvell. Copy the inf file from C:\Windows\Inf to the Marvell folder. Copy all the files listed in the Driver File Detail list to the Marvell folder.
3. Build the MVP Tool again and see how it does.
EDIT:
I just saw Ian's post above concerning the RAID drivers. We were posing at the same time. You could try using the same procedure as described in 2. above to replace the IRST drivers included in the MVP Tool with the drivers from your system. That may help. Don't worry about the cat files. You won't need them. Just get the 2 inf files and the 2 sys files.
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IanL-S wrote:I see that the system appears to have an X79 chipset with an c600/c220 SATA controller. This can be described as venerable hardware (the Windows 7 driver is dated 2013), that supports Xeon CPUs. It is critical that the correct RAID drivers are installed, as newer Intel RIST do not work with some older hardware. I notice there is also a Marvel 91xx controller - is this on the motherboard or is it on a PCIe card. It appears that there is nothing attached to this controller. Are you loading drivers for this controller? If not try including them. Not sure why it should make any difference, but it could.
Ian
Ian,
Thanks for your input. Keen eye or knowledge about the x79 chipset. This CyberPower PC is about 6 years old and was well equipped at the time. It has a Gigabyte x79-UP4 motherboard in it.
As far as the Marvel 91xx ... I looked at the details and see it has an install date of 1:50am this morning!! That means it may have been something I did as I was working on this 'mess'. When I could not get the WinPE or the Linux version to work I was trying the "Acronis Universal Restore" ... Admittedly I don't really understand that feature. I may have pointed it to my 4TB TI backup USB drive and to my C: RAID drive not knowing exactly what I was doing and thinking it was just gathering info for a boot USB or CD.
This 'Disk Management' screen capture above shows 'Disk 0' and I'm not 100% sure but I don't think I've always seen that 100MB reserved area there. I may have done that with the 'Acronis Universal Restore'. Clearly I know just enough just to be dangerous here!
CPU: Intel(R) Core™ i7-4930K Six-Core 3.40 GHz 12MB Intel Smart Cache LGA2011
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Mustang wrote:Great screenshots.
Hers's what I think. The IRST driver included in the MVP Tool should be correct. We will need a driver for the Marvell91XX controller. Also, there is probably a driver conflict between one of the drivers included in the MVP Tool and one of the controllers on your motherboard. This could make all drives disappear in WinPE.
1. Go to the Drivers_Custom\x64_Windows_7 folder and MOVE the following folders to a temp location. This will eliminate them from the build.
2. Go Back to Device Manger and look at the Properties of the Marvell91XX controller. Get the list of files from the Driver Files Details window and the inf file name. Create a new folder in Drivers_Custom\x64_Windows_7 named Marvell. Copy the inf file from C:\Windows\Inf to the Marvell folder. Copy all the files listed in the Driver File Detail list to the Marvell folder.
3. Build the MVP Tool again and see how it does.
EDIT:
I just saw Ian's post above concerning the RAID drivers. We were posing at the same time. You could try using the same procedure as described in 2. above to replace the IRST drivers included in the MVP Tool with the drivers from your system. That may help. Don't worry about the cat files. You won't need them. Just get the 2 inf files and the 2 sys files.
Thank you for your guidance. I didn't really understand your "1" because you mentioned the "following folders" but then didn't list any?
I took a stab at it and created a Marvell folder and move in the files as below.
Marvell
-------
__Details Driver__
C:\Windows\inf\oem7.inf
__Driver File Details__
C:\Windows\System32\drivers\mvs91xx.sys
C:\Windows\System32\drivers\mvxxmm.sys
C:\Windows\System32\mv91xxm.dll
I then copied all the IRST files to a 'temp' directory and deleted the *.inf & *.sys ones. I found the ones from my system in locations you stated and copied them in there.
Intel RAID
----------
__Details Driver__
C:\Windows\inf\oem32.inf
__Driver File Details__
C:\Windows\System32\drivers\iaStorA.sys
C:\Windows\System32\drivers\iaStorF.sys
*** RESULTS ***
After I rebuilt the WinPE again I was able to see my two logical Local Drives but the lettering is odd. Picture below. I tried to help eliminate this confusion/difference by creating folders on my C: and D: to identify them. (ie. '!LocalDiskC_MBR_212GB_NTSF_OS' and
'!LocalDiskD_MBR_885GB_NTSF_DATA' and
'!LocalDiskF_GPT_4TB_USB')
HOWEVER, none of my USB drives show up. [update: I have a mixture of 2.0 and 3.0 USBs] I see in the WinPE 'Drivers_Custom' / 'x64_Windows_7' there are two 3.0 USB drivers 'ASMedia USB 3.0' and 'Intel USB 3.0'. ---- I'm guessing I need to move those to a temp place and create a new folder 'Gigabyte X79UP4 USB' or something.
THEN copy my *.inf and *.sys files that match my system into that folder.
FINALLY then Build the MVP Tool -- WinPE USB again.
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SCOTT FAUQUE wrote:Mustang wrote:Great screenshots.
Hers's what I think. The IRST driver included in the MVP Tool should be correct. We will need a driver for the Marvell91XX controller. Also, there is probably a driver conflict between one of the drivers included in the MVP Tool and one of the controllers on your motherboard. This could make all drives disappear in WinPE.
1. Go to the Drivers_Custom\x64_Windows_7 folder and MOVE the following folders to a temp location. This will eliminate them from the build.
2. Go Back to Device Manger and look at the Properties of the Marvell91XX controller. Get the list of files from the Driver Files Details window and the inf file name. Create a new folder in Drivers_Custom\x64_Windows_7 named Marvell. Copy the inf file from C:\Windows\Inf to the Marvell folder. Copy all the files listed in the Driver File Detail list to the Marvell folder.
3. Build the MVP Tool again and see how it does.
EDIT:
I just saw Ian's post above concerning the RAID drivers. We were posing at the same time. You could try using the same procedure as described in 2. above to replace the IRST drivers included in the MVP Tool with the drivers from your system. That may help. Don't worry about the cat files. You won't need them. Just get the 2 inf files and the 2 sys files.
HOWEVER, none of my USB drives show up. [update: I have a mixture of 2.0 and 3.0 USBs] I see in the WinPE 'Drivers_Custom' / 'x64_Windows_7' there are two 3.0 USB drivers 'AMedia USB 3.0' and 'Intel USB 3.0'. ---- I'm guessing I need to move those to a temp place and create a new folder 'Gigabyte X79UP4 USB' or something.
THEN copy my *.inf and *.sys files that match my system into that folder.
FINALLY then Build the MVP Tool -- WinPE USB again.
USBs --- well I had no luck getting to any of my USBs by trying something similar to what you guys suggested for the harddisk.
Below is what I setup to match what I believe my USB config is.
Folder: 'Gigabyte X79UP4 USB' in .../Drivers_Custom/x64_Windows_7
-------
__Details Driver__
C:\Windows\inf\disk.inf
__Driver File Details__
C:\Windows\System32\drivers\aswArDisk.sys
C:\Windows\System32\drivers\disk.sys
C:\Windows\System32\drivers\fltsrv.sys
C:\Windows\System32\drivers\iaStorF.sys
C:\Windows\System32\drivers\partmgr.sys
Repeat USB driver info and then the Device Manager USB section.
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Good progress. At least we can see the RAID drives. Don't worry about the drive letters. WinPE has its own way of assigning drive letters. That is normal to different letters than in Windows.
Sorry about not including the list of folders to eliminate. I meant to list:
ASMedia USB 3.0
Intel USB 3.0
NIC
Samsung NVMe
Let's work on the USB issue now. You will need drivers for both the Fresco Logic Controller and the Fresco Logic Root Hub to get the Fresco Logic ports to work. Follow what you did for Details and put the files in a Fresco folder. One hint to make sure you have included all the files you need is to open the inf files with notepad.exe and search for the line [SourceDisksFiles]. Under that line will be a list of all the files needed. Then try to identify the Fresco Logic ports and plug the Seagate drive into one of them.
Don't try to put in the drivers listed under Seagate Expansion in Device Manager. If you get the USB port it is plugged into to work, the drive will show up. Take that folder out.
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Scott,
The USB drivers can be tricky to get working. I had a look and found that the Fresco USB appears to be an add in PCIe 2.0 card. If you cannot get the USB fixed following the advice of Mustang then you might try adding the drivers from the link below. Your Device Manager list shows the Fresco device as a version FL1009. If you grab the drivers from the link provided here make sure you get the right version and OS files.
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Mustang wrote:Good progress. At least we can see the RAID drives. Don't worry about the drive letters. WinPE has its own way of assigning drive letters. That is normal to different letters than in Windows.
Sorry about not including the list of folders to eliminate. I meant to list: ASMedia USB 3.0, Intel USB 3.0, NIC, Samsung NVMe
Let's work on the USB issue now. You will need drivers for both the Fresco Logic Controller and the Fresco Logic Root Hub to get the Fresco Logic ports to work. Follow what you did for Details and put the files in a Fresco folder. One hint to make sure you have included all the files you need is to open the inf files with notepad.exe and search for the line [SourceDisksFiles]. Under that line will be a list of all the files needed. Then try to identify the Fresco Logic ports and plug the Seagate drive into one of them.
Don't try to put in the drivers listed under Seagate Expansion in Device Manager. If you get the USB port it is plugged into to work, the drive will show up. Take that folder out.
Enchantech wrote:
Scott, The USB drivers can be tricky to get working. I had a look and found that the Fresco USB appears to be an add in PCIe 2.0 card. If you cannot get the USB fixed following the advice of Mustang then you might try adding the drivers from the link below. Your Device Manager list shows the Fresco device as a version FL1009. If you grab the drivers from the link provided here make sure you get the right version and OS files. Fresco Drivers
Thanks a bunch guys. I should get back to this in the next day or so. Sometimes these problems can be draining as you both certainly know and I'm in the middle of a few things. I spent quite a few hours researching and staying up late on this and need to catch up on some rest. I need to resolve this tho otherwise it seems I'm just wasting my time with backups. I am doing a nightly 'basic copy replicator (if diffs)' backup of my 'document' and 'picture' directories for a belt and suspender approach for the time being. Helps preserve files but not all my pgm installs and customization done over the years!
I appreciate your time so far! I belong to and help others on different forums where I have other interests/hobbies. I know it can take time and energy.
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<snip> --- delete this post mods -- thanks
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Going to do some more testing to see if I can get WinPE USBs accessible today.
Re: The USB drivers can be tricky to get working.
Oddly Linux doesn't have any problem seeing my USB drives. I'm pretty naive with Linux tho. I backed up my LocalC (sda+sdb; aka md126 RAID pairing today). Will do my LocalD (sdc+sdb; aka md124) tonight before I go to bed.
Picture is from the CloneZilla command line option. I used the lsblk cmd. I'm learning but have a better idea now. It appears sd_ are physical drives and then it shows the md_ (Multiple Device) raid devices (like numbers showing pairing).
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YEAH!!! It is working showing all my USBs now. HUGE thanks folks!
I eliminated a couple of the folders mentioned and added the Fresno folder. I copied the INF, SYS, & DLL files from the controller and hub. I did not download any new drivers thinking that I have working drivers on my current system so I should utilize these as a safer concept of it working.
QUESTION: What should I do to verify that the ATI will work with my setup? I was looking for a verify TIB option or something. Perhaps backup a folder or spare USB drive using the normal boot ATI, then change or modify the USB content, then boot from the WinPE and recover the entire USB? Call be paranoid.
Fresno (Controller FL1009 Series)
-------
__Details Driver__
C:\Windows\inf\oem34.inf
__Driver File Details__
C:\Windows\System32\drivers\FLxHCIc.sys
C:\Windows\System32\WdfCoInstaller01009.dllFresno (Root Hub)
-------
__Details Driver__
C:\Windows\inf\oem33.inf
__Driver File Details__
C:\Windows\System32\drivers\FLxHCIh.sys
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Great news. That's what we want to hear.
There doesn't seem to be any way to just validate a backup from the WinPE recovery media. You can run a backup from WinPE and then go back to Windows and run a validation. When you go to restore from WinPE media, you will see the Options at the lower left light up near the final step of the restore process. Clicking on Options brings up a window with a checkbox to validate the archive before restoring.
Doing some actual restores is a good idea. The best test is doing a full disk restore to a spare drive instead of restoring to the original drive. However, that does involve the expense of having a spare drive.
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Ditto :)
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You can validate backups from the rescue media but you need to start as if you are going to do a Recovery, select the backup .tib or .tibx file, then right-click on the selected file to see the Validate option.
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Thanks for pointing that out Steve. I had tried that by using the Recover My Disks button in the middle of the GUI. and found it didn't work. Now I see you need to click the Recover tab on the left side of the GUI and right click the tib file to get the context menu with the validate option to show up.
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That's correct Paul, it has to be from the Recover option to see the right-click menu.
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Steve Smith wrote:You can validate backups from the rescue media but you need to start as if you are going to do a Recovery, select the backup .tib or .tibx file, then right-click on the selected file to see the Validate option.
Thanks much. That was *very* useful. I had whole 'disk backups' as well as 'file backups' so I had to use both those tabs.
It worked OK. The time estimates were a ways off but still were reasonable i.e. x1.5 times as long as they said so 10-12 minutes kind of thing.
All gives me much more confidence upgrading to Win 10 and bought a key from Amazon last night (you download the files from Microsoft). I will likely take CloneZilla images too. Belt and suspenders. :)
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Definitely a good idea take precautions such as using another backup software. I am lucky in not having had anything going wrong when upgrading from Win 71. to Win 10, but I did have issues with one PC moving from 8.1 to 10.
Please keep us informed of your progress.
Ian
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All gives me much more confidence upgrading to Win 10 and bought a key from Amazon last night (you download the files from Microsoft).
Scott, you can still upgrade from Windows 7 (or 8.1) to Windows 10 for free provided you start the process from within the active Windows 7 desktop. I have done nearly a dozen of such upgrades over the last couple of weeks for friends and family. This will work until such time as Microsoft decide to actually turn off their activation servers to stop it!
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Steve Smith wrote:All gives me much more confidence upgrading to Win 10 and bought a key from Amazon last night (you download the files from Microsoft).
Scott, you can still upgrade from Windows 7 (or 8.1) to Windows 10 for free provided you start the process from within the active Windows 7 desktop. I have done nearly a dozen of such upgrades over the last couple of weeks for friends and family. This will work until such time as Microsoft decide to actually turn off their activation servers to stop it!
Eeek, I've been reading mixed things about this. Found this article with the steps. Would you mind confirming that these are the steps you successfully took? ITA P.S. My Win 10 Key is no-returnable but I could keep it for a future computer.
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Scott, the process is fairly simple:
The Windows 7 desktop must be the starting place! You cannot boot from the Win 10 install media directly or else it will wipe out the existing OS.
Go to the Windows 10 Download web page and click on the second link for the Media Creation Tool and save this to your local drive or desktop.
Once the tool is downloaded, run it from the Win 7 desktop.
If all goes smoothly, then you will have Windows 10 #1909 when the process is completed.
The process is in several parts: first it downloads the install code in the background, next it goes through a preparing phase (counting up to 100%) and finally, it will reboot to do the final install phase, followed by the normal quick configuration options if wanted!
Note: the code download is around 5GB size. The upgrade will match the edition of Win 7 that you already have, i.e. Win 7 Home to Win 10 Home. If you have bought a key for a different edition such as Win 10 Pro, then you can do a simple license key upgrade after the main upgrade is done via the Win 10 Settings pages to change from Home to Pro.
I have only had one laptop that didn't go smoothly in the dozens of systems I've done this for, that one got to around 70% through the final install phase then rolled back to Windows 7 with an error in the FIRST_BOOT phase. I resolved that after 3 retries by doing an in-place upgrade of Windows 7 SP1 (on top of the same) to fix whatever the underlying Win 7 issue was, then the upgrade went through as smoothly as the rest!
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Steve Smith wrote:Scott, the process is fairly simple:
The Windows 7 desktop must be the starting place! You cannot boot from the Win 10 install media directly or else it will wipe out the existing OS.
Go to the Windows 10 Download web page and click on the second link for the Media Creation Tool and save this to your local drive or desktop.
Once the tool is downloaded, run it from the Win 7 desktop.
If all goes smoothly, then you will have Windows 10 #1909 when the process is completed.
The process is in several parts: first it downloads the install code in the background, next it goes through a preparing phase (counting up to 100%) and finally, it will reboot to do the final install phase, followed by the normal quick configuration options if wanted!
Thanks much!
a) My wifes laptop (now Win10) --- I was able to test this on my wife's laptop. I used the MVP ATIPE builder to create a WinPE USB and it worked asis this time (ie didn't have to fiddle with custom drivers. It has ATI 2018 on it.
I was able to verify from the WinPE the ATI backup I did thru the native ATI.
The process took a few hours this morning and only had one hiccup where it wanted to remove Win 2017 Virtual drive environment which I did but there was not a continue type button but only a (back) and (refresh). I did them them both a couple times and oddly it finally recognized something and continued. After that all went smoothly.
I installed the 'Open Shell' from my son's recommendation and the interface (start menu, etc) have a Win 7 type of look so it is easier for me to navigate. (avail on github as open source https://github.com/Open-Shell/Open-Shell-Menu/releases/)
b) my desktop Win 7 PC, I had plan to go to Win 10 on Monday. THEN today I'm seeing one of my main C: (win OS) RAID drives is being disabled. Picture below. I saw this 1.5 yrs ago and that night I found the same model drive on ebay so I bought it. THEN the next day the error went away!! All the tools I use to look at my RAID devices showed my C: raid as 97% healthy. Now I need to research and figure out how to replace the drive!!
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I made an update earlier today but must still be in moderation review because of a URL link or something.
My RAID 0 problem of my main C: drive having a 'degraded' disk that was coming up with "Status: Missing; Type: Unknown Disk; Location: Controller 255, Port Unknown' ... ended up going away mysteriously again. I got out my ebay purchase drive and printed Intel direction on how to use their utility for this ... I paused when it said: "if failed disk is part of OS, you will also need to reinstall the OS". --- what the heck. Must be some Windows cloning/theft hardware level identification stuff.
ANYWAY: I decided since I had good backups and since our old laptop upgrade work this morning (per my post in moderation) ... that I would just uninstall all my firewall (Outpost) and virus (Avast) software and anything else autoloading (Process Lasso) and do the Windows 10 upgrade.
HAPPILY, I am writing this from a Windows 10 upgraded machine! Will need to do quite a bit of organizing ... at least that's my excuse.
I did install/run the 'OpenShellSetup_4_4_142' tool to give my Win 10 a easier to use and familiar Win 7 look and feel. All seems great.
Re: ATI --- I have no idea how my 'version chain' Full, Incr, incr ... Full, Incr are going to work after this upgrade since I was in the middle of 6 Incrs backups. I considered deleting my Full and Incrs so I would just start with a Full tonight but then I think I need to keep them in case something goes wrong. UPDATED thought -- duplicate my C: ATI backup so it starts FULL again tonight. Turn off the scheduled time for the old C: ATI backup.
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Scott, glad to read that the upgrades to Win 10 have gone smoothly. I too use Open Shell and have done so almost from when Win 10 came out though it has gone through a couple of name changes (Classic Shell > Classic Start > Open Shell).
For your backups, I would definitely suggest drawing a line in the sand between those you had for Windows 7 and starting a new set for Windows 10. I tended to make a new full backup of the old OS before starting the upgrade, then another new full after it was completed.
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Steve Smith wrote:Scott, glad to read that the upgrades to Win 10 have gone smoothly. I too use Open Shell and have done so almost from when Win 10 came out though it has gone through a couple of name changes (Classic Shell > Classic Start > Open Shell).
For your backups, I would definitely suggest drawing a line in the sand between those you had for Windows 7 and starting a new set for Windows 10. I tended to make a new full backup of the old OS before starting the upgrade, then another new full after it was completed.
Well I celebrated too soon ... dang nabbit! I'm on our Win10 laptop now. I came downstair to my PC being off. I thought that is weird ... I thought maybe there was an option to shut down the PC after my new C: Win 10 backup in ATI that I had on.
NOPE, I only get the two screens below and then the machine reboots over and over. I tried all the keys to get into bios without any luck. What I don't see is the Intel RAID 'bios' screen which shows the status of my drives. I don't know what that means. It is, obviously, odd that I had that 1 harddisk 'degraded'/unrecognized_drive long ago and just recently BUT I would think that even with a bad drive that I would *still* see the Intel RAID 'bios' screen.
I tried to put in the WinPE boot USB but that is not recognized that I can tell.
Currently at a loss and bummed. Yes, I realize this thread is beyond ATI backup/recover at this point. Sorry.
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Scott, all I can suggest would be to do a complete power down of the problem system, and perhaps check that all your BIOS settings are still shown correctly?
I don't have any systems that use RAID in the true sense of having multiple drives in a RAID array (apart from my Synology NAS). My laptop has a 1TB HDD second drive using RAID mode for a single drive.
I would normally suggest doing a BIOS reset to defaults on a normal system but not sure if that would damage your RAID array?
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This could either be due to defective hardware or a corrupt BIOS. The first thing I would do is to start removing drives and see if that helps. Start with removing the two RAID drives with your OS. The goal is to get back into the BIOS. If that doesn't get you to be able to access the BIOS, remove the rest of the drives. If you can't get into the BIOS with all the drives removed. Try removing memory sticks one at a time. If none of that works, you may have a corrupt BIOS. Is there any way to re-flash the BIOS at this point without entering the BIOS. What is Q-Flash? Did you try the F12 Boot Menu key?
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Steve Smith wrote:Scott, all I can suggest would be to do a complete power down of the problem system, and perhaps check that all your BIOS settings are still shown correctly?
I don't have any systems that use RAID in the true sense of having multiple drives in a RAID array (apart from my Synology NAS). My laptop has a 1TB HDD second drive using RAID mode for a single drive.
I would normally suggest doing a BIOS reset to defaults on a normal system but not sure if that would damage your RAID array?
I'm not quite sure what a 'computer power down' means as after a few auto-reboots it does, I hold the power button down for a few seconds and the machine does shut all the way off. I have to hit that power button again for it to start up.
The odd things are:
a) is is that I can't get into my bios using any of the F keys or the Del key per the bios menu options that flash up.
b) WinPE USB won't boot up
c) I no longer see the Intel RAID menu options (CNTL-I)
I brainstormed with my oldest son who is geeker than I now and he wondered if the button battery on motherboard has gone. I don't know if that is still a thing anymore. Anyhow, I am just brainstorming and I appreciated your input.
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Found my motherboards manual and where the battery was because I didn't see it with the cover off. Under the graphics card that takes 1 slot but is two slots wide. I had some CR2032 batteries so I tested them to see over 3.2V. Was able to replace the battery in about 20 seconds as most references said it takes a minute to reset the CMOS. Boot result was the exact same. End up testing old battery before putting voltmeter away and it showed 3.2V actually. Heck.
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Scott, try the suggestions given above by Enchantech Mustang ref isolating the drives and memory to reduce the system down to the minimum configuration.
In terms of powering down, shutdown as normally as possible, then remove the power lead and then hold the power button down to drain any charge held by capacitors on the motherboard. It may be necessary to leave the computer in that state for an hour or so (not holding the button!).
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Mustang wrote:This could either be due to defective hardware or a corrupt BIOS. The first thing I would do is to start removing drives and see if that helps. Start with removing the two RAID drives with your OS. The goal is to get back into the BIOS. If that doesn't get you to be able to access the BIOS, remove the rest of the drives. If you can't get into the BIOS with all the drives removed. Try removing memory sticks one at a time. If none of that works, you may have a corrupt BIOS. Is there any way to re-flash the BIOS at this point without entering the BIOS. What is Q-Flash? Did you try the F12 Boot Menu key?
Thanks guys. I really appreciate your input. I've been on the phone with my son (who built his own PC recently) to brainstorm and try some things.
We ended up concluding to disconnecting the questionable drive in my C: RAID. I knew the S/N of my good one so I unplugged the other one.
Booting again brought up the following screen below which said the bios was corrupt and it would be repaired.
That then allowed the BIOS to come up. Booting up gives me the 'Win 10' boot error about an inaccessable boot device. So along with my bios being corrupted it seems my C drive was corrupted.
Two things keeping me from moving forward with this PC: 1) I no longer see the Intel RAID menu opton, 2) my BIOS USB options are all enabled (legacy, 2.0, 3.0) however there is no USB options available in the boot order or option within the bios screens or on the F12 boot order screen.
I have not found any options within the BIO that help with either of those two things. I'm suspicious about the motherboard and BIOS now.
I booted with the CloneZilla CD I created. No options show USB drives if I didn't have a USB device inserted or if there was one in the 1st or 2nd front USB slots.
I'm going to do some research on my two issues above (no intel raid menu and no USB) but I may have to give up on this PC and get/build another (keeping only the graphics card, power supply, and D raid drives).
Once I turned off the 'full screen logo' in the bios I saw the American Megatrend graphics and their BIOS options. I guess that F7 is a menu option to 'qflash' or upgrade the bios but I've never done that. Suspect you'd do that with a USB access which I don't have.
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Scott, I am not an expert on these dual BIOS systems / issues, as have been fortunate to have never hit any such issues on any system with the same. I would suspect that there may be differences between the backup copy of the BIOS and what was held in the corrupted main copy, such that you should work through the BIOS configuration following the recovery, and check that all the settings are as you would expect them to be?
If you have a good full disk backup of the system from before these latest issues, even if this is from Windows 7, then it might be worth trying to recover that backup to a single, non-RAID drive, assuming that you can overcome the USB boot device aspect.
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Scott,
I have experience with and do run multiple machines with dual bios chips. Since you have never updated your bios your system would be configured as follows:
Original settings as shipped from the manufacturer.
Working settings after configuration of RAID arrays.
Your statement that you no longer see the Intel raid menu tell me that the lose of the one raid drive did corrupt the bios in some manner. When you successfully powered down the board by unplugging the power supply and removing the button battery and then again started the machine, the POST (Power On Self Test) process could not run the corrupted configuration so it reverted back to the Original manufacturer settings meaning that you RAID configuration has been lost. Of course this means that the machine will not boot. It also means that it is likely you will have to start over again in recreating the RAID arrays which will unfortunately wipe all the data from your disks.
Before going to extremes however I suggest that you first enter the bios, find the SATA settings and look for Mode or SATA Mode. This should be set to RAID. If it is set to AHCI try changing it to RAID then save and exit the bios. With a bit of luck turning on the SATA RAID mode will enable the Intel Raid menu and also allow the machine to boot to Windows again.
Post back your findings.
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I fully agree with Enchantech. I had suspected your failed RAID drive had corrupted the BIOS. That's why I suggested removing the OS RAID drives first. There is nothing wrong with your motherboard. Now that the backup BIOS has been installed as the main BIOS, you need to start all over again.
You should replace the failed drive. Putting the failed drive back in will probably corrupt the BIOS again. You will need to set up the RAID array again as Enchantech suggested. You will also need to go through the entire BIOS settings to get them as they were as Steve suggested. You need to pay attention to any USB options like enabling Legacy USB. You also need to enable CSM to enable USB boot. After you have done all of that, you will need to restore your best backup. If that is Windows 10, great. If that is Windows 7, you will need to upgrade to Windows 10 over again.
Now this is important, most dual BIOS systems have an option in the BIOS to backup BIOS A to BIOS B. You need to do this. Then if the backup BIOS gets put back to the main BIOS in the future, all your setting will be the correct setting you chose instead of the factory default settings.
The main lesson here is never leave a drive installed that starts to show any sign of failing. Replace it before the problems like this occur.
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Adding to my earlier post, you should investigate if the issue you are having with the failed drive may be something as simple as a faulty data cable. I have had many instances in which a data cable has became faulty over time and is the source of odd problems. Example, I have an NAS server computer I built in a SSF (Small Form Factor) box using a mini ITX motherboard. It supports 4 HDD's which host a ZFS file system. ZFS is like RAID on steroids, in fact it is also referred to as RAID-Z. Because of my use of a SFF box I also used a small, lite, loomed 4 SATA data cable. It worked fine for a few years then, it began to produce CRC errors on one drive during nightly scrubs. I found that if I unplugged the cable to that drive and reattached it, the errors would go away for a awhile but would return again over time. I finally just replaced the loomed cable with 4 single premium SATA cables and have not had any errors since.
Since you are running RAID 1 on both of your arrays you essentially have mirrored drives in both arrays. This means that the OS will boot from a single drive as long as RAID mode is enabled in the bios. You can leave the suspected faulty drive disconnected while you attempt to turn back on SATA RAID mode. It if boots then you should be able to replace the faulty drive/cable, boot the machine, and the Intel Raid Controller will rebuild the new drive into a new mirror.
I fully agree with Mustang on the USB settings, CSM, etc. Also in your use case his advice on setting a backup of the bios is great advice.
As information, the dual bios design as found on enthusiast motherboards like yours, in practice are used by enthusiast to backup bios settings once a stable working configuration has been achieved in memory timing and overclocking. Then, when a newer revision is released the bios can be updated and if it proves unstable or otherwise not desirable the user can revert back to the backup configuration.
Hope this all helps.
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I appreciate you guys helping me back from the ledge! Clearly I know just enough to be dangerous.
I will try to respond in an organized way but when you are in the midst of things it can become blurred.
Enchantech -- Before going to extremes, however, I suggest that you first enter the bios, find the SATA settings and look for Mode or SATA Mode. This should be set to RAID. If it is set to AHCI try changing it to RAID then save and exit the bios. With a bit of luck turning on the SATA RAID mode will enable the Intel Raid menu and also allow the machine to boot to Windows again.
I took out both of the C: RAID SSD drives and connected them to a SATA to USB adapter/upgrade cable. I was able to then plug that USB into our laptop and using Win10 explorer was able to see the contents OK on both drives. Using HDSentinel (.com) was able to see the 'health' and 'performance' of both of them. It appears to be based on S.M.A.R.T. stats.
THANKS to your suggestion I was able to see/understand the SATA mode option. I was able to change it to RAID and it booted!! Initially the Intel RAID bios screen had a status of REBUILD and NORMAL for C: & D: respectively. Then after getting in and out of Win 10 I saw C: as NORMAL and D: as VERIFY. So I'm guessing when you are in Win 10 that in the background iRST is doing the rebuild/verifies. NOTE from the Win 10 Control and Program Uninstall screen I could see the iRST was installed when doing the Win 10 upgraded. I can not longer click on the icon in the system tray and open up the iRST app (says to reboot or reinstall) but I do see the green check mark on the icon within 20ish seconds after Win 10 boots so I think the service is running in the background. Plus my Intel RAID bios status changed over time today (ie. Verify to Normal for the C: drive).
Will continue in another post with responses.
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Mustang:
You need to pay attention to any USB options like enabling Legacy USB. You also need to enable CSM to enable USB boot.
Thank you. I did determine that the USB on the back of my PC work as I can plug in my external drive.
I'm a little confused by the CSM reference. I was ignorant about it and looked for some videos and such. I found one for my BIOS and it appears they changed the format / header of an area (which you had to scroll down to).
Old says CSM support and my similar BIOS calls it 'Windows 8 support'. I did some searches as well as looked at an outdated manual and it is not clear to me what option will allow my USB drives to be bootable. I would have guessed the 'Boot Mode Selection' but it is set to UEFI and Legacy ... so I thought that would work. Clues for me to look at?
Mustang:
Now this is important, most dual BIOS systems have an option in the BIOS to backup BIOS A to BIOS B. You need to do this. Then if the backup BIOS gets put back to the main BIOS in the future, all your setting will be the correct setting you chose instead of the factory default settings.
Yes, that seems obvious in hindsight dang nabbit and I wish I would have done that. I don't see anything exactly like a A to B or backup option. I do see what they are calling 'profiles' which is probably a high level name for all the settings. It gives me several backups! I've used the 1st one!
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Enchantech: Hope this all helps.
All three of you have been ridiculously helpful and generous with your time. I will pay this forward in whatever ways I can.
Enchantech:
I found that if I unplugged the cable to that drive and reattached it, the errors would go away for a awhile but would return again over time. I finally just replaced the loomed cable with 4 single premium SATA cables and have not had any errors since.
As mentioned I did take out the drives and have plugged them back in being careful to seat them firmly. There is a mess of wires in the area of the drive in question but it seems hard there would be interference. As well supposedly the SeaSonic Platinum power supply my machine came with is fairly well known to be of good quality and I would have guessed it came with quality cables. My 'good quality' ref is from my son who looked at various power supplies for his recent build.
Enchantech:
Since you are running RAID 1 on both of your arrays you essentially have mirrored drives in both arrays. This means that the OS will boot from a single drive as long as RAID mode is enabled in the bios. You can leave the suspected faulty drive disconnected while you attempt to turn back on SATA RAID mode. It if boots then you should be able to replace the faulty drive/cable, boot the machine, and the Intel Raid Controller will rebuild the new drive into a new mirror.
Well I do have a matching drive that I bought from ebay a couple years back, however, when I read the below Intel instructions I was concerned about 7 because it indicated I would need to reinstall the OS.
Are you saying/thinking that if I just identify the drive (S/N) that has shown problems a couple times that you think I could simply replace it and then it would automatically get rebuilt to match the existing good C: drive in the RAID. That is, of course, what I had hoped and logically thought the benefit of the dang RAID 0 was when I opted for it. The instructions below are just unclear as it indicates I have to 'Delete RAID Volume' (4) and reinstall the OS. I'm confused.
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I just rebooted and my RAID status for both C: and D: have been set to NORMAL. So the service must be running in the background when Win 10 is up.
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Great to hear you got it back. Now you need to figure out why it all happened. As Enchantech suggested, you should replace the SATA cable on the drive in question. This is the data cable not the power cable from the power supply. It goes from the drive to the motherboard and has the smaller end. The power cable has the bigger end.
Setting the CSM to boot both UEFI and Legacy is correct. You should be able to find another section for USB. Under that you should find something about enabling Legacy USB support. This needs to be enabled to boot from USB devices.
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Scott,
Looks like patients, perseverance, and a little research paid off! That's great!
So to clear up a couple of things for you.
First is that your RAID levels for both arrays is in fact RAID 1, not RAID 0. How do I know this? Simple really, the Intel Raid Menu shows it. Looking at the last image in your post #46 you will see that both raid sets are "os - RAID1 (Mirror) and Volume0 RAID1 (Mirror).
Note that the lower section of the image shows the drive configuration. The OS array of Corsair drives, each drive 232.5GB setup as a raid1 mirror array as Disk(0) total capacity of 212.4GB.
The Volume0 array of WD drives, each 931.5GB setup as raid1 mirror array as Disk(1) total capacity of 884.9GB.
So at the end of the day you're not using RAID0 you are using RAID1 which gives you the safety of having two drives acting as a single drive that are mirror images of each other.
Scott said:
Are you saying/thinking that if I just identify the drive (S/N) that has shown problems a couple times that you think I could simply replace it and then it would automatically get rebuilt to match the existing good C: drive in the RAID. That is, of course, what I had hoped and logically thought the benefit of the dang RAID 0 was when I opted for it. The instructions below are just unclear as it indicates I have to 'Delete RAID Volume' (4) and reinstall the OS. I'm confused.
In answer to this question, Yes. Note your screenshot in post #43 of the Intel Raid menu, at the bottom of the image it says "Volumes with "Rebuild" status will be rebuilt within the operating system". In other words the Intel app you have installed in Windows will detect the "Rebuild" status of the replacement drive and "Mirror" the "Normal" drive to the replacement.
Scott said:
So I'm guessing when you are in Win 10 that in the background iRST is doing the rebuild/verifies. NOTE from the Win 10 Control and Program Uninstall screen I could see the iRST was installed when doing the Win 10 upgraded. I can not longer click on the icon in the system tray and open up the iRST app (says to reboot or reinstall) but I do see the green check mark on the icon within 20ish seconds after Win 10 boots so I think the service is running in the background. Plus my Intel RAID bios status changed over time today (ie. Verify to Normal for the C: drive).
Yes, your guess is correct. I suspect that the system tray icon for the iRST app has become broken and is why it no longer works. You can remove that link from the tray then locate the iRST executable file, right click on it and add it back to the tray to get it working again.
Finally, DO get yourself some premium SATA data cables for all of your drives and replace them with what you have especially if the cables in use currently are the cheap thin manufacturer cables. Premium cables are well worth the investment. :)
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Mustang:
Setting the CSM to boot both UEFI and Legacy is correct. You should be able to find another section for USB. Under that you should find something about enabling Legacy USB support. This needs to be enabled to boot from USB devices.
I'm still puzzled because I had the 'Legacy USB Support' enabled as well as all the other USB related options. I did read/see_video where on some bios there is a 'security' feature (if I understood correctly) that doesn't allow booting from the USB. [update] Check the manual the Legacy USB support on my bios says: "Allows USB keyboard/mouse to be used in MS-DOS." -- I guess that could be related to booting into a cmd line DOS interface.
Mustang:
Great to hear you got it back. Now you need to figure out why it all happened. As Enchantech suggested, you should replace the SATA cable on the drive in question. This is the data cable not the power cable from the power supply. It goes from the drive to the motherboard and has the smaller end. The power cable has the bigger end.
Doh! Sorry, it was 3 am and what I said obviously made no logical sense. Of course, he was talking about the data being corrupted somehow traveling on a bad data cable.
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Scott,
In the Boot tab of your BIOS setup you should see and entry for Secure Boot. If this is enabled it may prevent the booting of a USB flash drive. Temporarily disabling that option if it is enabled could fix the issue.
Those SATA data cables look like cheap OEM cables by the way.
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