Using MVP Log Viewer with TI 2021

Oops!  I forgot to mention one thing.  If you run your backups on a timed schedule and not manually, then my solution of not letting the service start at startup will not work.  You will have to let the service start on startup and then turn the service off to view the log viewer and then turn it back on when finished.  I start my backups at night manually (only do one computer every night and the others only after having used them which is not every day) so this works for me.  When I click on start the backup I get the message and click to start the service which I do and the backup then runs, I go to bed, and it shuts down when finished.  Use which ever method works for you - turn it off at startup or let it start at startup.

The main point I was trying to make is that this service is what is causing the issue with the log viewer.

The MVP Log Viewer does not deal with new log file setup introduced in ATI 2020; you should use the MVP Assistant instead.

Ian

Thanks Ian!  I do have the Assistant, but I have not figured out how to delete all log files at once over a specified number of days as I do in the log viewer.  I see how to not see them, but not how to delete them in bulk.  Any help on that would be appreciated.

I guess I'd better chime in here.

As to the issue with the Scheduler logs, there was a change to ATI 2021 (I think maybe the second release) which caused the scheduler log to be opened exclusively. Unfortunately, that presents a problem for anything else trying to access it. The solution is to just stop and restart the service right away. That will cause a new version of the log file to be generated so you can then read the old one. No need to leave the service off. [I submitted feedback on this some time ago but doubt anything will be done. I have a note for the next version of the MVP Assistant to restart the service if the user is trying to open the latest Scheduler log and permits it.]

Bulk deletion of log files is actually quite easy to do. I suggest looking at the top pinned topic on this forum where I addressed this issue some days back.

I also suggest reading through the log viewer documentation in the Help. It's not fancy, but hopefully will explain things. Look at file culling and also look at repositories. The repository feature can be very handy if you have multiple machines on your LAN running True Image. If you share the True Image data folder, you can use the MVP Assistant on one machine to inspect logs on other machines.

Any other questions of comments on the MVP Assistant may be directed at me through the forum or as a PM.

Thank you Bruno!  I have read the help again but paid more attention.  I now understand the culling and how to select files older than a specified date and then delete them.  At 80 it takes a little longer to sink in sometimes, and I appreciate yours and Ian's comments.  Extremely helpful!

Bruno,

I see how to select the older logs I want to delete, but when I then click on active logs, repositories, delete from active logs, start, I get a message saying I need permission from administrators to perform the action.  My account is an administrator account and it doesn't make any difference if I right click on the app and select run as administrator. 

Maybe I missed something?

Maybe I'm missing something. I'll have to look into it. I can tell you that starting the app as administrator is different than just running from and administrator account.

Can you post or PM me a screenshot of the error?

Here is the error:

From the filename it appears that the log is under the new Agent Core Managers log type. I just went to my system running ATI 2021 and when I tried to Explore to that log folder I got a permission error of C:\ProgramData\Acronis\Agent.

Basically, I suspect that some of the Acronis folders are protected. I know that they did a recent change where the latest Schedule2 log is protected where I can't even open it.

I expect that if you Cancel your error, it will just go on to the next file. If you have the Pause on error option set in the dialog to start the delete, you will need to continue. If Pause on error is not set, it will just go on.

If you deselect the Agent Core Managers from your culling options, hopefully everything else will go. I cannot say right now what other folders may be affected.

Or, try using Windows Explorer to navigate to the folder mentioned above and when it says you need Admin privilege to continue, give it. Maybe that will allow the Assistant to process the deletes.

My wife is awaiting me to cook dinner, so no time to test tonight.

I assume you went to the settings page to enable bulk deletion of active log files. Since you are deleting in folders that Acronis considers theirs, care must always be taken.

Keep me posted.

Bruno,

Thank you for bearing with me.  The Log Viewer and this Assistant are good apps and I can appreciate the effort you put into them.  I have used the Log Viewer since you first released it and it always worked without a problem.  Without one or the other these log files can grow to a huge size over the years ans eat up a lot of space.

I tried several things: 

1. I added myself (user) to full permissions to the entire log folder in Program Data/Acronis/TrueImageHome where they are located and that did not work. 

2. I can view the Agents folder, and I am already listed as a user with full permissions.  I can also view the Schedule2 folder and added myself with full permissions.

3. I did not try to take ownership of the folders though as I really didn't think that would make any difference.  Maybe it would.

4. I tried different combinations of selected logs in the culling option and that did not work.  My last attempt was to select only the Demon logs to delete, and that did not work.  Same error message on every attempt.  I did select and deselect the pause error in all the attempts.

5. I tried as I had with the Log Viewer of turning off the Scheduler2 process, and that did not work with the same error message, but that still works in Log Viewer and I am able to delete everything older than two days as I had before.

It seems that Acronis has protected that entire log folder with that recent update which I think was update 3 for TI 2021.  I usually don't upgrade Acronis for a few months until they have an update or two so that maybe they have fixed the bugs in the new version by that time and that is why I had just upgraded a few days ago.  I have used the app since the 2010 version and I know their history.  In fact, I fought with their help folks about six years ago so much that they even denied me from ever seeking their assistant again.  They didn't like me telling them that I had forgotten more than those people knew.  I have been building computers since about 1985, and I kind of know what I am doing.  That pissed me off, but the app is the best backup/restore app out there and having to restore a number of times without a hitch is the reason I stick with it. It has saved me mucho grief.  I backup my desktop every night and each of the two laptops each time I use them.  The third laptop I just did a transfer of a TI 2019 license from one of the three as it is old anyway.

Jim

Jim, I just did some investigating.

First, let me ask you about your terminology. I'm not certain when you refer to Log Viewer (e.g. point 5 in the previous post) whether you are referring to the old MVP Log Viewer (which I had nothing to do with) or the new MVP Assistant Log Viewer.

I was able to delete files alright on my system. I suspect the issue may be in the way you are using the Culling option for choosing files by date. The file you failed on was dated Feb 26, which was the date of your first posting so I suspect the file was currently in use by Acronis and was not filtered out as you wanted.

I remember spending a lot of time to be able to handle the file selection because there are files that can span long periods and it was necessary to account for this.

The way I handle date culling is to run the file through a filter to see if it should be displayed. In this filter, the start date of a file is generally considered to be the date it was created. The end date is the date last modified.

If you say Older Than 30 days and the start date of the file is less than 30 days ago, it is rejected.
If you say Not Older Than 30 days and the start date of the file is more than 30 days ago, it is rejected
If you say Newer than 30 days and the end date of the file is more than 30 days ago, it is rejected
If you say Not Newer than 30 days and the end date of the file is less than 30 days ago, it is rejected.
If it is not yet rejected, it is shown.

Consider that a log file can be both older than 30 days and newer than 30 days.

If you want to delete the files older than 30 days, you are best advised to select NOT Newer Than 30 days.

Please also check what is being displayed before deleting to be sure you've got what you want.

FYI, if you want to be safe, after culling you could create a new Repository to make a backup of the files you are about to delete. After deletion, if you are happy you can remove the repository. Also, you should be sure to select to send deleted files to the Recycle Bin if you feel you may need to recover.

I hope this helps.

Bruno,

Yes, I was referring to your Active Logs when I said Log Viewer in the first reference in #5 and the MVP Log Viewer in the second reference in #5.  Sorry, I just wasn't clear on that.

We played golf today so I didn't have time to mess with it, but I did just try some more following what you have suggested and then I will spend some time on it tomorrow when I have more time.

I selected to show only the Demon logs in the culling process as I know they would not still be open.   So they are the only ones that show in Active Logs.  When the backup completes, those close and I thought if they won't delete then something else is going on. I do two backups each night - one for my data drive (SSHD) and another for my system/programs drive (SSD), so there are two logs for each day - the 24th, 25th, 26th, 27th, and 28th.  I selected first to show only those older than two days and then I tried what you said of showing only those not newer than 2 days.  Either way it shows the logs I want to see - 24th, 25th, and 26th, and the logs for the 27th and 28th did not show as they should not.  In both cases they would not delete because of the same permission error.

I think I understand the culling, and I have tried every way I can think of, but the with the same failure.

I don't think I am missing something, but I just feel like something else is going on.  What, I don't know.  Acronis installed correctly and I had closed any running apps and my Windows virus & threat protection was turned off temporarily during the install. 

I I feel like I am being a pain in the you know what, but I am stumped and I really would like to use your app.

Jim

Bruno,

Update:

I have run an Acronis repair install on two computers right clicking to run as administrator with Windows Anti--Virus and SpyHunter5 turned off.  Still get the same message when I run your app even when I leave both turned off when attempting to run it.  I used the Demon logs only as I previously did in both attempts.

It puzzles me that I have not seen any other folks with this same issue on this site, and it makes me wonder if I have a problem on my end, albeit with two different computers it does seem rather odd.

Jim

Jim, if you ignore using the MVP Assistant tool and go directly to the folder holding the logs and try to delete them from there - are you able to do so?

If not, then is Acronis Active Protection active on your PC?  If yes, then turn this off and try again.

Bruno,

Would not delete directly - got the permission error again.  Turned of Active Protection and tried to delete directly again and got the same permission error.

I tried deleting just one demon log in both cases - not multiple ones.

Jim

Jim, just checked on my own PC and had no issue with deleting a single demon log to the recycle bin (with AAP turned off).

So do you have any other security utilities / settings that may be preventing this from being done on your PC?  Is Controlled folder access enabled in Defender

Jim, if you are getting the error just trying to delete the file from within Windows Explorer as Steve suggested then there must be some ownership issue going on with your system.

Perhaps you could check the ownership of the folders. Look at Properties, Security tab and click Advanced.

Bruno,

Controlled folder access is off and I took ownership of the c:\ProgramData\Acronis\TrueImageHome\Logs and all of its subfolders, added myself to the permission, and made sure I was listed under auditing with full control.

None of that helped either with direct deletion or with your app.  Still get the same permission error.

I can tell you in the past MS and its permissions has given me fits over the years since they changed it.

I can still use the old MVP Log Viewer by temporarily turning off the scheduler2 service and it works fine, but I would like to be able to use your app that is newer and more powerful.

Thank you for continuing to look into this for me.  Hopefully you can find an answer. 

Jim

Jim, if Windows is not allowing you to delete logs directly from Explorer, then the same restrictions would exist trying to delete them running the MVP Assistant. You seem to be saying you can delete the logs using the old MVP Log Viewer but that does not make any sense to me.

I don't know why you would turn off the scheduler2 service to run the old log viewer. The only problem with the service running is that you cannot access the current Scheduler2 log, but the older ones should be visible.

I know nothing about SpyHunter... maybe it's doing something.

You took ownership of c:\ProgramData\Acronis\TrueImageHome\Logs, but maybe the issue of ownership is higher up the folder path (c:\ProgramData\Acronis). Not all the logs are in the c:\ProgramData\Acronis\TrueImageHome\Logs folder.

You have done repair installs, but I doubt that would affect the data folders. For that I think you would need to completely uninstall and reinstall ATI 2021, making sure that the data folder is gone in between.

Without actually seeing specifics about what you are doing it is hard for me to further understand the issue.

Bruno,

When I run the old MVP Log Viewer without turning off the service, I get the attached error.  It is longer than I can snip, but you will get the idea.  When I turn it off, the app runs as it always did - I see everything and can choose what I want to delete by entering the number of days old I want.  If I click continue on the error, it will continue with nothing showing and if I click on a log type, i.e. demon, I will see the entire list but not the contents in the lower part of the screen.

SpyHunter is not the problem because in the tests I have completely turned it off.

When I only took ownership of the demon log folder and folder permission is the problem, then I should be able to manually delete anything from that folder, but I cannot.

I have even added exceptions in Acronis Protection Exclusions for the MVP Log Viewer and your app allowing them to make changes to my backups, and that had no effect.

I may try to uninstall and reinstall Acronis, but right now I am kind of tired of messing with it. The instructions for installing were that if one was running 2019 or 2020 you could install 2021 as an upgrade without uninstalling 2019 or 2020.  If you were running 2018 or older you must uninstall that version and then install 2021.  If I were to reinstall, I would uninstall it delete everything associated with it and then do a clean install, but I really don't think that is the problem.  I believe it is something with the way Windows is setup on these two computers.

For now, I will just use the older app as it is easy to do and it works with my work-around.  Sorry, I would like to use your app, but right now I am burned out trying to make it work.  Maybe if I get away from it for a few days, a light will go off in my head and the solution will come to me.

Thanks so much for your efforts!!!  If I figure it out, I will post here.  

Jim

Jim, what version of the old MVP Log Viewer are you using? I have three versions here, 2.10, 2.21 and 2.27 (beta). Of those, only 2.27 gives the same error as you get when I open the program. But if I continue, it seems to work OK except that when I close the program the splash screen is still up and cannot be closed so I kill it with Task Manager.

In spite of that, I see that all versions of the old MVP Log Viewer can still access the open Scheduler2 file whereas my program cannot. Therefore, I suspect some different .NET usage that is involved.

Bruno,

I would agree with the .NET being the issue.  I thought that from the beginning as that is what the error message is titled when opening the MVP Log Viewer.  I think I am up to date with the .NET versions as I religiously keep all of my computers up to date.

I am using version 2.10 but I tried 2.21 yesterday with the same results.  I didn't even see the 2.27 beta available to download, but if I had it I would give it a try.  Maybe my results would be the opposite of yours - 2.27 doesn't throw the error, but 2.10 and 2.21 would.  Worth a try if I can get it.

BTW - I did try changing the ownership of the entire Acronis fold in ProgramData to me and that didn't work either.  It just has to be something with .NET, but I don't understand you not having any other problem comments about it.

Steve, sorry I didn't notice a couple of posts came from you - sorry for not acknowledging that.

I will play with it some more tomorrow.  This afternoon I was getting very discouraged and just wanting to forget about it.  I went ahead and used the old app and deleted exactly what I wanted - about 200 files and it errored on just 4 or 5 logs as it always does because they are still open.  I just click cancel on each one of those and it continues until finished.

Jim

Bruno,

I decided I would uninstall 2021 on both computers and do a clean install and see if that made any difference.  It did not as I still get the same error when opening the MVP Log Viewer either 2.10 or 2.21 but it will work as before if I turn off the scheduler2 service.  I can't tell yet with your app as I will need a few days to let it accumulate some data so that I can delete those older than x days.

I used the Windows add-remove programs and then ran the Acronis cleanup so that there was nothing left of Acronis on either computer.  Even though it didn't help with the old log viewer and I really doubt it will help with your app because I still think there is a .NET problem, but by uninstalling I got rid of over 200 of old .opt files on my desktop computer (the laptop is only 4 months old) that it would not let me delete that were taking up a bit of space plus the clutter of them.  Not sure why they are even there as all they are are a simple step by step recap of each backup and they seem useless to me.

I did not change any permissions or ownership of any of the folders as that didn't help before and doubt it would now.

It did take a while to do the desktop computer because I have three backups - data, system SSD, and a backup SSD that I can boot to if needed that I use Acronis to restore to from the system SSD backup once a week.  And, I have each backup make a reserve copy on another removable drive.  By keeping the last six backups for each that adds up to 36 existing backups I had to add back into Acronis.  Took a little time, but the cleanup was worth it.

Doubt if this helps, but I wanted you to know what I tried.

Jim

Jim, a bit of an update.

I have discovered that the error you are seeing in the old log viewer versions 2.10 and 2.21 I am also seeing on all versions, but only when I run the program as administrator. The error in opening the 2.27 beta version when not running as administrator was something different.

I have been communicating with FtrPilot to try to nail down why we are seeing what we are seeing with respect to the lock Schedule2 log.

Bruno,

I will be anxious to hear what you guys find.

I still cannot get your app to bulk delete logs, however I can delete individual logs, i.e. an old Demon log.  I did find a key in the registry that I thought might be causing the problem but so far it didn't help.  The key is - : HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Acronis\FileProtector where there is a sub-key named LogExpiredPeriodInDays and Acronis sets it to 7 days.  Note the name of the key is "File Protector" which makes me think it is involved.

I changed it to 2 days and then culled logs older than 2 days and also tried culling logs not newer than 2 days.  I even tried the two in combination.  None of those worked, but I do see the logs I want to see anyway I cull them.  I got a permission error on every log and it even showed logs newer than 2 days it was going to delete but errored on those also.  It could be this key is the answer and your app will work for me if I leave it a 7 days and then try culling older or not newer than 7 days.  It may be that even though you can change the value, Acronis doesn't really recognize it and has those logs protected for 7 days regardless of the setting.  I know from the past, they can be very protective of everything in their app.

I don't know what else to try, but I will wait and try the 7 day exercise in a few more days.  I will let you know.

I just don't see what I am doing wrong as your app is actually easy enough to follow and your help text seems to cover what I need to do.

Jim

Bruno,

You can tell FtrPlt we now have different problem opening the old log viewer.  I opened Acronis this morning and it had an update for ATI2021.  When I try to open the old log viewer the error message now has nothing to do with the scheduler2 service but is a different log it cannot access – see attachment.  Now, even if I turn off the scheduler2 service, it will still not open as it should.  Just as before, if I click continue I get the list at the top, but no details at the bottom.

Also, I was wrong with your app as I cannot delete individual logs as I thought I could and this is also happening with ATI 2019 on the old laptop it is installed on.  Yesterday when I did the update Tuesday updates on all of the computers, I tried running your app on that one, and I get the same errors, but the old log viewer works fine with no errors and it opens just fine.

I will try again tomorrow on this desktop when I have log files older than 7 days as now the oldest is 3/4/2021 and that is 7 days and not more than 7 days.  I can cull and see exactly what I want, but to delete is impossible.

Don’t know what they changed with the update, but it is sure different now.

Jim

Bruno,

Well, I just tried it again and now I am getting the scheduler2 error when opening the old log viewer and not that new error message.  Not sure what the heck is going on.

Jim

Jim, I've been very busy on some other stuff over the past week. But, still trying to understand more about what is happening.

I've been confused by some of your posts so it may help to get some screen shots of the discreet steps you are taking in the MVP Assistant to delete log files. I'd like to see exactly what you are doing.

Bruno,

Attached are 6 snapshots of what I am doing.  On the culling it doesn't make any difference if I select older than 7 days or not newer than 7 days as the results are the same.  The names of each are self explanatory.

I have logs dating from the 4th thru the 11th and I culled those older than 7 days and you can see what the logs looked like before culling in the 1st and what my culling options are in the 2nd.  You can see by the 3rd and 4th snapshots I am seeing only those older than 7 days.  So, I think I have the culling down without issue.  The problem comes when I start to delete as you can see by the 5th and 6th snapshots.

On each file it is a permission error, and if you remember I had earlier changed the permissions on the entire \ProgramData\Acronis folder by adding me (not just administrators) and changing the ownership to me and none of that helped before I did the re-installation.  They are back to normal after the re-installation of ATI.

Also, as I said yesterday I get these same results whether I do it with ATI2019 on the laptop or with ATI2021 on this desktop.

I am puzzled as I know you are, and I really do appreciate you helping me.  I do want to use the app!

Jim

Bruno,

I thought I needed to re-mention that with the older MVP Log Viewer v. 2.10 or 2.21 after I turn off the sheduler2 service and can open it, I can delete all the files without error even when I set it down to older than 2 days using either ATI2019 or ATI2021.  Previously with 2019 I did not need to close that service, but now I do.

Jim

Jim,

I've been looking back at this thread and I do not see a clear answer to this question... Can you delete the log files directly from Windows Explorer... not using either the old MVP Log Viewer, or the new MVP Assistant? If you are having trouble deleting from Windows Explorer, then the issue is not the viewer but something else in your system.

Are you absolutely certain True Image was installed with proper Administrator level?

Can you also show me screen shots of the steps taken to delete the files, not just the result.

Thanks.

Bruno,

All 4 of my computers are setup the same way - one account (me) and all are administrator accounts - see 1st attachment.  So, when I am logged into my account, Acronis is installed in an administrator account and should have full administrator rights.

I cannot delete anything in the C:\ProgramData\Acronis folders using Explorer even though the entire folder properties are set as you see in the 2nd and 3rd attachment.  I get the error you see in the 4th attachment.

The 5th attachment shows the Assistant screen when I have culled and selected a single Demon log to delete.  I couldn't get a snip of what I do, but I click on Log Files - Delete File, it asks if I am sure I want to delete, I click on yes, and get the error on the 6th attachment.  When I want to delete bulk logs, I click on Repositories - Delete from active logs, and that is when I get the error shown in an attachment in the previous post.

With my setups I have had very few problems ever accessing a folder on any of my computers by not clicking continue when Windows tells you you need permission to continue.  The only time that does not work is on folders like the System Volume Information folder.  I just cannot see where my setups could be the problem.  I can delete virtually anything anywhere on all of these computers except when it comes to Acronis, and that includes the Windows folder.

Jim

Jim, I compared my system security settings for C:\ProgramData\Acronis and they look like yours. When I got through the steps you do to delete the file, I am able to delete it alright. If running the MVP Assistant unelevated (not as Administrator), I get an extra message from Windows to Continue and then it deletes the file.

Because you cannot delete them from Explorer, I would say the issue is with Windows and not with Explorer the MVP Assistant.

Check the security settings for the Demon file you are trying to delete. The file will have different ownership than the C:\ProgramData\Acronis folder.

Bruno,

I have come to the conclusion that the problem is with ATI 2021 and not Windows, the MVP Log Viewer, or your Assistant.  Here is why I have come to this conclusion.

I just completed testing on one of the laptops with ATI 2019 and this is what I found.  The Log Viewer 2.10 and 2.21 open without having to disable the scheduler2 service.  2.21 will delete files without error but not as many or as complete as 2.10 does.  I can delete individual logs with the Assistant without problem, but I have to skip thru a lot of logs when trying to bulk delete as it is attempting to delete logs newer that what I culled for.  They show up in the list even though I have culled them out.

With ATI 2021 I believe Acronis has protected these logs more than in the past and particularly with the update I did a few days ago.  I still cannot delete individual logs with the Assistant or can I do bulk deletes in ATI 2021 without all the errors.  Attached is a snapshot of the error I get when running the MVP Log Viewer 2.10 in ATI 2021 when trying to delete as I do in ATI 2019.

I have never asked and you have never mentioned what version of ATI you are running and doing your testing on.  I am curious.  You are correct in that some folders in the c:\ProgramData\Acronis have different ownerships.  Some are Administrators and some are System, but they are exactly the same in ATI 2019 as they are in ATI2021 so I don’t think that has anything to do with it.

I really don’t think they like you or FtrPlt trying to mess with their program and those Russian engineers have taken measures to make it harder for you to do so.  I may be way out of line, but in my humble opinion I do believe that is what is going on.

Jim

Jim,

The reason you don't have to disable the scheduler2 service to run the old Log Viewer against ATI 2019 is that the current Scheduler2 log is only "locked" in the ATI 2021 version Build 2 and later. That (and one other file) is what causes the issue.

If you are culling out logs in the MVP Assistant and they are showing up in the list, then the culling is not set up correctly. If you want me to look at that issue, please show me a shot of the culling dialog settings, and a display of a log that you think should not be listed.

Apparently MVP Log Viewer 2.10 is hitting the same roadblock as the MVP Assistant when doing a bulk delete. I don't know what that roadblock is.

I develop the MVP Assistant and do most of the testing on ATI 2019, but I also test it on ATI 2021. As for your issues, I've been testing those on ATI 2021.

Acronis are aware of these programs... so much so that they are hosting the download locations and link to them from the product itself. If you go to the Tools section of the ATI UI and select Third-party tools, it opens up their KB Community Tools page from which you can download the tools.

Bruno,

Ready for dinner, but here are the snips you requested.

Jim

I'm not seeing any problem with the culling. You want no logs newer than 4 days old and the demon and other logs you are showing are all over 4 days old.

Bruno,

That is correct, but it will not delete those Demon logs and others within the culling range giving me an Administrator error on some and a System error on the Demon logs.

Jim

To add my two penny worth here!

I have just done a cull of all my logs over 30 days old and had just one ti_demon log that could not be deleted due to the same error as reported by Jim (apart from other logs locked by ATI 2021 for such as licensing etc).

The problem ti_demon log had an extension of .log.bak for some reason, and could not be deleted until I forced all the Cyber Protect services to be stopped.  This brings up another concern here as I have all the new Protection features supposedly 'Turned off permanently!' in the settings on the Protection panel!  Effectively this is saying that protection for Acronis files is still in place regardless of the protection being turned off!

I haven't tried to delete any logs 'newer than 4 days' being tried by Jim and wouldn't want to do this but culling older, unwanted logs is fair game to get rid of!

Steve,

Thank you!  Your last post made a light go off in this old man’s head.  I long suspected the Acronis Protection Service was causing the problems.  They need to stick with backups, etc and let folks who deal with cyber protection and all do their thing.  I have used SpyHunter for several years now and have found they catch everything and it is even compatible with Windows Virus Protection.  It is not free, but it is worth every penny I pay every six months.  Between the two, I have been well protected for years and do not need the Acronis protection.  In fact, Acronis Protection has flagged two different apps that I have used for years as dangerous and they are not.  So, I don’t trust their new toy anyway so why use it.

The problem with it is turning it off.  You are correct that turning it off in the app doesn’t do a thing, and there is no option in Windows Services to turn off either Active Protection or Cyber Protection.  You must disable both of them, but they will both load anyway either on startup or when you open ATI.  The only way to turn them off is to disable both in Windows Services and then thru the Windows System Configuration by unchecking both boxes.  I think the first one is the only one you really need to uncheck and disable, but I did both.  Now, that will work and you can run the MVP Assistant without issue, but if you open ATI it will turn the Active Protection on.  So, if you are going to clean using the MVP Assistant, then you must do it before opening ATI.  Once you open ATI and then want to use The Assistant then you must reboot so that the configuration file reloads with the two Acronis services turned off.   As I said – you cannot turn them off manually.  It is unreal that it is so complicated to turn some of the Acronis services off and even then, it is not permanent.

This works until Bruno can figure out a way to get around the Acronis nonsense and/or Acronis changes things so that we have an easier way of disabling their protection.

I did several tests using both the MVP Log Viewer and the MVP Assistant by deleting and then restoring from the Recycle Bin to do it again trying different time frames and culling options.  The MVP Log Viewer will delete most logs as it always has as long as you turn the scheduler2 service off (it restarts automatically when you open ATI anyway), but the MVP Assistant will clean even more.

I had 10 days’ worth of log files and I culled then to delete anything older than 4 days in the final test.  I also found that in the culling if you uncheck the three Agent Core selections, the Licensing, and the ZMQ Client you will only get errors on open logs and none for ones that need administrator approval, or the like.  In the last try of deleting anything older than 4 days with these options it deleted 123 of 129 logs with the six being open logs it could not delete and that is ok and what I expected.

I know this is not the ideal way to have to get around a problem, but it does work.  Bruno, I would welcome any comments from you on this or if you can think of a different way to get around the Active Protection.

And, BTW I absolutely appreciate all that have commented on this thread and tried to help me.  THANK YOU!

I may be 80, but working on my computers, building new ones, and keeping up with the new technology is how I keep my mind active and really working and not turning to mush.

Jim

Jim, can you please clarify to me your statement above... "The only way to turn them off is thru the Windows System Configuration by unchecking both boxes." You mentioned back on March 3rd that you'd turned off Active Protection and it still failed. Just trying to understand exactly what you did or didn't do. On my system I have Active Protection turned off in the ATI UI, but I have not disabled the Active Protection or Cyber Protection services and am not having the same issue.

Anyway, it does seem like you've now made progress.

I am still quite stumped about why it is that the old MVP Log Viewer can display the current scheduler2 log when nothing else I find can view it.

It's late now and I will take another read through of the latest posts when I am more alert.

A late night follow up...

I'd been doing most of the previous testing focusing on the demon logs as those were identified as being problematic. But I was seeing no problem there.

I decided what the heck and did a bulk delete of everything over a week old. Out of over 400 logs, all but 38 were deleted. These logs were all under the Active Protection, Cyber Protection, MMS and ZMQ Client types. It also helped to run the Assistant as administrator.

I have not tried to stop the services.

Bruno, like you I haven't needed to go into disabling the new protection services to cull older logs with the exception of the one strange log that had the .log.bak extension that simply could not be deleted by any method I tried until after I disabled / stopped AAP, ACP etc!

In other testing in this area, my powershell scripts to disable these protection features are no longer giving me the same positive results since the last build 39184 was installed - so Acronis have changed something in that area too!  The 'good news?' is that I am seeing much less obvious indication that the background protection services are active when all is turned off permanently! (Which was part of my reason for using the scripts!).

Karl mentioned in a post in the MVP forums that Acronis have a tool that they can use to turn off all the new Protection so will have to wait to see if they will use this as part of the internal change request: TI-213392 Allow installation without Antimalware components for those users who do not want all this extra unwanted bloat in ATI!

Bruno,

You are correct that earlier I had turned the protection off in the ATI UI, but yesterday I found that doesn't really turn it off.  The only way to turn them off is unchecking both in the Windows System Configuration and also by setting them to disabled in services.  There is no way in services to stop and/or start either of those services.  The problem is that when you start ATI it will turn the protection service back on (not the cyber service) even though it is set to disabled and not started on boot thru the configuration manager.

When I do this, your app runs perfectly without any errors and deletes all logs that I have culled for except those that may be still open.

I still don't understand why you can run it without doing this and I cannot.  Also, I have tried running as administrator and that doesn't help either.

I did read thru this post this morning and a lot of folks hate this situation albeit none have said anything about it causing problems with your app.  https://forum.acronis.com/it/forum/acronis-cyber-protect-cloud-forum/ho….

Until Acronis chooses to let us turn off this bloatware what I am now doing does work and is a minor inconvenience so as to be able to use your app.

Jim

Jim, I have submitted a support case this afternoon after seeing how much logging is going on for both Cyber Protection and Active Protection on my main laptop despite having set all Protection to be 'turned off permanently'!  When I look at the logs they show constant logging with evidence of these supposedly inactive features scanning Windows System components, checking for updates etc!  With the previous builds of ATI 2021 (prior to #39184) I had completely disabled all the background services etc via some powershell scripts but with this latest build if I use the same approach, I can no longer sign in to my Acronis account or connect to the Acronis Cloud for backups!!!

Steve, this amount of logging has been a concern of mine since the beta as we've discussed before. Take a look at the size of the C:\ProgramData\Acronis folder and you will see that even without protection on you can still be wasting well over half a gig between the database (a biggie) and the logs which are constantly being updated.

I gave up trying to figure out how to at least reduce logging when not using protection. I was hoping the selective install would be out by now.

Bruno, my folder is also sitting at around 560MB too which makes a mockery of the 25MB max size for an Acronis System Report when submitting a support ticket!  This is after culling all the logs to under 30 days old only.

Bruno,

Acronis has been notorious for creating an abundance of log files that I am not sure are even needed.  You have to get to a level three agent before they even know what you are talking about.

I just discovered something interesting.  If you remember before disabling the two services in the configuration manager I said I could not delete, change name or anything else in the Acronis Program Data folders using Explorer, but when the Protection Service is turned off as I said above I can now do all of those things without getting a permission error.

I was able to delete those .opt files in c:\ProgramData\Acronis\TrueImageHome\Database without the admin error, but I soon as I open ATI and the service is automatically started again, I am back to where I cannot do any of those things.  I reboot so it doesn't start again and I am back to where I can do those things.

I do two separate backups each night and it writes an .opt file for that backup as well as one for the reserve backup for each and that is what I was trying to delete.  That amounts to four useless files added every night and they do accumulate - almost 1500 in a year. They are really useless as they are nothing more than what is in the demon logs except in a slightly different format.  Would it be possible for you to add those files in that folder to be viewed and deleted in your app?

It isn't perfect, but if I remember to use your app before opening ATI, I am ok.  It really is a small inconvenience to be able to use your app until they figure out that a lot of folks don't want this bloat and they should stick to what they do best and that is providing the best backup app I have ever used.

Jim

Jim, if I look in the same C:\ProgramData\Acronis\TrueImageHome\Database then the opt files that I see there are essentially copies of the script .tib.tis files for my backup tasks found in the C:\ProgramData\Acronis\TrueImageHome\Scripts folder and nothing like the ti_demon log files.

These are only 4kb in size on average and add up to less than 50kb so not really adding any significant size to the drive.

Steve,

You are correct in the size, but if you don't delete them and with me having 4 written each day that adds up to almost 6meg in a year.  I hate that much clutter.

Jim